Nothing different between to 2 days..temp right at 70 degrees, sunny. I haven't tried to release clutch slightly in 1st gear with the brakes applied and feel it, but I will...When the tech drove with me other day, it was just a ride along...(he was busy, had just gotten back from lunch). The service consultant (yeah, that's what they're called now) seemed uninterested and had me wait for the tech to get back from lunch. They did not connect anything to the car, probably because I'd just had that done a week or so earlier and there were no codes or anything...And he still never got back with me concerning the "research" he was going to do. I had planned to set up an appointment with that dealership to take the car in, but I'm not convinced they'll be able to do anything that the other dealership hasn't already tried except to charge me the 70 or 80 dollars for the diagnostics.
There does seem to be a difference since the weather has been cooler outside 40's and 50's...it still does it, but not as noticeable. I'm wondering if it's worth taking to the second dealership to see what can be done. I was told that they won't just replace the cat because if it turns out not to be the problem, then they have to pay for it...sounds like a load of crap to me, but I don't know for sure...I'm thinking about having it replaced by something other than the dealership and just fill out the reimbursement form sent by GM. I'm at a loss...like I said, I love this car for what it is, but it's driving me crazy..
Hmm, that's really interesting. The description is very familiar to what I'm experiencing, however, in my situation, the care idles fine. There is no variance in rpm when the care is idling. The shutter, surge, miss, I feel is at low rpm in any gear with a load on the engine...Appreciate the link though, it's really close to what I'm experiencing.
Nothing different between to 2 days..temp right at 70 degrees, sunny. I haven't tried to release clutch slightly in 1st gear with the brakes applied and feel it, but I will...When the tech drove with me other day, it was just a ride along...(he was busy, had just gotten back from lunch). The service consultant (yeah, that's what they're called now) seemed uninterested and had me wait for the tech to get back from lunch. They did not connect anything to the car, probably because I'd just had that done a week or so earlier and there were no codes or anything...And he still never got back with me concerning the "research" he was going to do. I had planned to set up an appointment with that dealership to take the car in, but I'm not convinced they'll be able to do anything that the other dealership hasn't already tried except to charge me the 70 or 80 dollars for the diagnostics.
There does seem to be a difference since the weather has been cooler outside 40's and 50's...it still does it, but not as noticeable. I'm wondering if it's worth taking to the second dealership to see what can be done. I was told that they won't just replace the cat because if it turns out not to be the problem, then they have to pay for it...sounds like a load of crap to me, but I don't know for sure...I'm thinking about having it replaced by something other than the dealership and just fill out the reimbursement form sent by GM. I'm at a loss...like I said, I love this car for what it is, but it's driving me crazy..
"Research" is calling the Tech Assistance Center, I would go back and say l paid the hour rate to diagnose my car, it's still doing it, it's your on your dime this time to figure it out. Speak to the Service Manager if the service writer does not understand they didn't figure it out. They can only charge you an hour no matter how long it takes to figure what is wrong. If they don't help at the stealership then call Pontiac about the lack of service you are getting. When you are speaking to Pontiac and you own other GM cars don't be shy about letting them know you are a loyal GM customer. Both GM and VW asked me about my other cars when dealing with their area customer service reps if I own or have owned any other their products. Both times I answered yes and seem to help.
Yeah, with some free flowing mods you hear it all the time. I threw my turbo back on after over haul and was listen to the engine in the garage. I have Kappashere exhaust so it's more pronounced at idle or 2000 rpms. GM probably tuned it out at idle or a constant parameter like idle but I could hear the engine pick rpms/load during a thump as I call it with my mods.
Next is to put your hand by the muffler at idle and feel the exhaust flow. With a stock system it might be muffled but you may be able to feel uneven air flow.
Or stop by Autozone and watch the timing parameter. Turn up the radio or some mods and enjoy the car.
Or find someone with HPTuners and have them shut off idle stabilization and suffer engine surging.
Yeah, took it back to the dealer**** the week after I paid for the first service/diagnosis. The second time they had it ALL day, so I didn't stick around to see specifically what was done to the car. When I picked it up that evening, they told me basically the same thing..."they feel it, but don't know what it is"..needless to say, I did not pay for this piece of useless information. Again, I brought up the issue with the cat's in the '06 and was told that it shouldn't be the cat. That's when I decided to take it to another dealer**** that seems just about as interested in keeping me as a GM customer as the first. We do have 2 GM products, an 06 HHR which we've been totally happy with and the 06 Solstice which has been nothing short of a pain in the a$$. I think it's about time to contact GM to see what can be done. Don't know who to try to get a hold of, but I'm sure I'll find somebody. Now, it's not just the fact that the car isn't running as it should, but it's the lack of concern of the dealerships. If this is their way of building consumer confidence, then they're falling way short. I'm going to give it a few more weeks and an attempt to get some answers from GM. Like I said, this car just turned 15,000 miles...that just isn't right..If I don't get it fixed or any help (which I'm more than willing to pay for if it gets fixed), then I think we're going to trade both the solstice and hhr in on 2 Jeep Wranglers...and if it get's to that point, I'll never buy another GM product in my lifetime. I had similar issues with Toyota back in '89 with a brand new truck that I purchased. The 6 months I owned it, it was in the shop for 3 of those months. Thank God Kentucky had a lemon law and I was able to dump it. Haven't looked at a Toyota since...
I have an 06 also and has been doing the same thing for most of the 45000 miles I put on it. The only miles that hasn't been doing it was when the VVT intake actuator was replaced after it threw a code p0011. Recently it started again, jut got it back from the dealer today after they had it for 2 days. The mechanic says he can feel it but does not know what it is, they did a pattern test of the injectors, checked out the VVT actuators with regards to voltage and resistance reading, re-flashed the ecm with an drivability update. Car is still doing it. I have had it to 3 dealers, two in Florida and one in Virgina. Next week I am going to ask them to get a factory rep to check it out.
Things that have been done in the past to try and fix this are:
1. Replaced one injector, cleaned the rest, replace the CAT replace both O2 sensors, re programmed the ECM ( 2 times) plus added updates.
I just watched the timing on the scanner(actually HPTuners). Most of the events you cannot feel at idle but timing does bounce 3-7 degrees. The big events the timing will jump over 24 degrees. Interesting stuff.
What is your guys driving style? If you can get on a on ramp a good run up through the gears would blow some carbon out deposits.
houseofboyd, the symptoms you are describing are what some have called "feeling like driving into a head wind". I have had just about every imaginable problem with my car. And with everything that has been repaired, none of the fixed failures every got rid of that feeling, until recently. I had a bad fuel system purge valve that was contributing heavily to the problem. I could barely feel it after they changed that part, but every once in a while I would still notice it.
But the final bullet was a new ECM. My ECM had a bad spot on the board which had been gradually degrading almost since new (corrosion caused by some water that got in it). The car finally completely crapped out one day. The ECM was no longer commanding the correct voltage to the coil packs. So the running theory is that it had been commanding some incorrect voltages to the coil packs intermittently for a long time, hence the "surging feeling, or driving into a head wind feeling". That feeling has gone, and I have not had it at all again, since they changed the ECM.
Here is a link to my horrendously long thread, you will find a lot of good information here. (my problems originally began with air charge codes, that where caused by different failures. However, after those issues were repaired, I had issues similar to yours). You will notice that I have not had any issues since they changed the ECM. I am at about 45 days with no more problems. GMPP Tune and P0101 code.
With your car being a first generation, I would still be leery of the CAT. Might be worth having that replaced at your expense, just to eliminate that variable.
@Boca_Sly, @GS Stage1 - Thanks for the information. I feel somewhat better knowing that I'm not the only one who is (has) experiencing this problem. Not so much of a problem as an inconvenience. To be honest, I wish the damn car would throw some kind of code, at least then, there may be something else to troubleshoot or investigate. Problem is, the techs think that since there is no code, everything is fine. After researching some of the cat issues, I am somewhat convinced that it isn't the cat. I could be totally wrong, but for now, I'm leaning towards something else. I do think it may be electrical in nature, maybe..hell, I don't know at this point..lol The ecm was flashed during it's first visit to the dealership, but that's it. What else they could do to troubleshoot the ecm, I don't know..Whatever this is, it wasn't something gradual. I just got in the car one day to head to work and noticed that it had developed this surge, sputter.
@NormSky - as always, your input is appreciated. In it's 15,000 miles I initially drove the car as normal as normal can be. I didn't dog it, but I didn't baby it either. The past few months, I've been driving the pi$$ out of it hoping that the problem will either go away or rear it's ugly head to the point that what ever is causing it will finally break. No luck yet...I've tried the regular gas to premium gas, every different brand available in my area and nothing makes a difference.
I was so embarrassed the other day, I was actually passed by a minivan on the entrance way to the interstate because I was in third gear, just sputtering along until I got to that magic rpm where it decided to run like it should....what a buzz kill it was....
Last edited by houseofboyd : 10-26-2009 at 09:58 PM.
At 1am this morning, I emailed a 2 page letter to Frederick Henderson, detailing the issue with the car, the feedback and work I received from 2 dealerships...I figured what the heck, it can't hurt to try. Besides, I've basically had 2 dealerships tell me that they do not know what to do to fix the sputter, stutter, surge or whatever you want to call it. Oddly enough, when I checked my email before work, I received a reply. It was not an automatic reply because he actually did not capitalize the H in his last name. Anyhow, the email was an apology for the issue with the car and trouble that I've had with both dealerships not being able to properly diagnose the proble. He also CC'd a guy named Scott Lawson and stated that I'd be hearing from them soon. So, I gues we'll have to wait and see...
Actually got 2 calls from GM on Friday, wanting detailed information concerning the issue with the my car and the two dealerships lack of interest or know how into fixing it. The woman that I spoke with apologized numerous times and was a joy to speak with. She seemed interested in what I had to say. She said that she would be contacting me again early next week...guess we'll see what happens next...She did state 2 interesting facts..the first dealership that I took the car to should have never released it back to me until it was fixed. Especially since they acknowledged the issue and stated that they didn't know what to do. She said that if it had been a safety issue, there could have been huge problems with them releasing the car not fixed...she also said that the 2nd dealership outright lied to me when they told me that if they replaced the cat and it didn't fix the problem that they would have to absorb the cost....
Nice to know that Henderson actually paid attention to you and got things rolling in the system. That puts him a couple notches up in my book, especially considering how he got the job.
Nice to know that Henderson actually paid attention to you and got things rolling in the system. That puts him a couple notches up in my book, especially considering how he got the job.
Well, so far, I must agree with you...The first dealership that I had taken the car to called me yesterday (Tuesday) to inform me that they had been contacted by GM and that they wanted me to bring the car in to "do a couple of things that GM had suggested"...So, I have an appointment to have the car at the dealership at 8am in the morning...What they'll be doing, I don't know, but I'm sticking around to see exactly what gets done. I do have one minor problem, since it's been getting colder outside, the problem isn't nearly as noticeable. I drove it to and from work yesterday and hardly noticed the issue, then today, it did it the entire way to work...so, I'm hoping that tomorrow won't be one of those days when the car decides to somewhat behave. Regardless, they're going to have to listen to what I tell them and not just brush it off because the car isn't throwing any codes. If they had done that to begin with, I wouldn't be in this situation...but yes, so far, my faith has been somewhat restored with GM's fast movement on this issue and their follow-up with the damned dealerships that should've done their job to begin with...
I am having the same kind of response with gm customer service. They set up an appointment at the local dealer where my car has been since yesterday morning. Customer service called today to make sure the car is there and is going to get some techs involved. I am really impressed with the attention GM is paying to their customers. They told me that since my extended warranty is up in December that if the problem is not fixed or comes back that that problem will be covered. I'll be really impressed when they fix this once and for all. Hopefully I will hear something tomorrow.
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