Ominous news about Solstice, courtesy Mark LeNeve...

[Fformula88]

Bloomberg is reporting, based on discussion with Mark LeNeve, GM North America Sales Chief, that Pontiac would likely be shrunk down to one model, a low volume, high desirable sports model akin to Corvette... and that the model would likely be the G8 sports sedan. (Although which model is speculative)

Bloomberg.com: Worldwide

GM May Shrink Pontiac to One Model From Six in Bid to Survive By Greg Bensinger Dec. 18 (Bloomberg) -- General Motors Corp. peddled Pontiacs for years with the slogan “We Build Excitement.” To stay afloat, it’s producing fewer thrills -- and models. The company may shrink the Pontiac division to a single model from six following a drop in sales every year since 1999. “It might be just one model,” Mark LaNeve, GM’s North American sales chief, said in an interview. GM joins Chrysler LLC and Ford Motor Co. in trimming brands as U.S. sales sag amid the biggest financial crisis since the Great Depression. GM has said it will run out of cash by the end of the month and is seeking financial aid from the government to avoid a collapse. While GM told Congress on Dec. 2 that it would shrink the number of models it sells, including at Pontiac, it hasn’t said previously that it might jettison all but one Pontiac brand. Paring Pontiac to a lone model would deprive GM of its third highest-selling brand after Chevrolet and GMC, and almost 2.2 points of U.S. market share accounted for by Pontiac’s sales of 358,022 vehicles in 2007. GM’s market share has dwindled to 22.1 percent from a peak of 51.1 percent in 1962. Sales of GM vehicles are down 22 percent through November of this year from the year-earlier period, including a 23 percent plunge for Pontiac to 250,902 units. Only Pontiac’s redesigned Vibe small car has increased sales this year. Gaining by Losing Jettisoning the Pontiac brands would help GM by cutting jobs and production costs, trimming advertising and eliminating lower-margin vehicles, said Efraim Levy, an equity analyst at Standard & Poor’s in New York. “GM can get more bang for their buck,” said Levy, who rates the Detroit-based automaker as “sell.” GM shares have fallen 82 percent this year. They rose 12 cents yesterday to $4.37 in New York Stock Exchange composite trading. The company, which scrapped the Oldsmobile line in 2000, said in its request to Congress for help that shrinking brands would result in 20,000 to 30,000 fewer U.S. hourly and salaried workers. GM already plans to eliminate its Pontiac Torrent sport- utility vehicle, said Debbie Frakes, a spokeswoman. GM gave no estimate of cost savings or worker reductions at Pontiac. The one remaining Pontiac would be a car to be sold alongside Buicks and GMCs, on a scale similar to its Corvette available in Chevrolet showrooms, LaNeve said. GM sold 33,685 Corvettes last year. ‘Lost Its Way’ While LaNeve wouldn’t name the remaining Pontiac, he described it as “a very high-appeal, performance-oriented model as opposed to a mainstream high-volume model.” It would be less expensive than the Corvette, which starts at about $50,000, LaNeve said. That most likely means the Pontiac G8 sedan, introduced this year in the U.S., said John Wolkonowicz, an analyst with IHS Global Insight in Lexington, Massachusetts. He said Pontiac may drop the G5, G6, Solstice and Vibe cars and the soon-to-be- released G3 compact. The cutbacks would mark the near-demise of a once iconic brand, he said. “In its heyday, Pontiac was a brand everyone wanted to own and no one would be embarrassed to drive,” Wolkonowicz said. “Pontiac simply lost that excitement; it totally lost its way.” First sold in 1926, Pontiac became known as a higher- quality alternative to Chevrolet. The unit developed a reputation for high-performance autos such as the now-defunct Bonneville sedan, eventually rising to third in U.S. sales behind Chevrolet and Ford’s namesake brand. Muscle-Car Era Pontiac’s 1964 GTO sports car ushered in an era of so- called muscle cars such as the Dodge Challenger and Chevrolet Camaro. “Pontiac at that time was the golden boy of the auto industry,” Wolkonowicz said. The division’s most popular model was the Grand Prix, with sales of 288,000 in 1977, GM said. Pontiac sales peaked in the U.S. at 896,980 in 1978, GM’s best year, according to trade publication Automotive News. By last year, they had fallen 60 percent from that record. Today, GM is trying to incorporate the brand alongside Buick and GMC models in dealer showrooms. GM also is rethinking the future of its Saturn unit and has put Saab and Hummer on the sales block. Ford said on Dec. 1 it will sell Volvo, while Chrysler is closing a Newark, Delaware, plant this year where it makes the Dodge Durango and Chrysler Aspen sport-utility vehicles. GM Vice Chairman Bob Lutz, who in 2005 described Pontiac as a “damaged brand,” has said the division hit a low point with its Aztek crossover SUV that debuted in 2001. Time magazine listed the Aztek among the worst 50 cars of all time in 2007, citing a “deformed and scary” appearance. Dealers Go Too LaNeve said GM will try to eliminate 1,700 of its 6,400 U.S. dealerships in five years, in part by normal turnover and combining showrooms for Buick, Pontiac and GMC, known internally as BPG. GM expects to lose about 400 dealerships after selling the Saab and Hummer franchises, he said. Reducing dealers helps cut competition, boosting sales at remaining outlets. The changes may add more desirable customers, said Charles Martin, who owns Classic Buick-Pontiac-GMC in Carrollton, Texas. “This could be a good thing for the BPG channel, by inviting younger buyers,” he said.

[Moose GXP]

Not very surprising, IMHO.

[CHEVYSOL]

Nobody knows what is going to happen. Not even the highest management.

LeNeve himself might not be there at the end of this week.

We have to wait until March to make out a trend, a possible tendency, a drift.
Until then any opinion, optimistic or otherwise, will be just blah-blah-blah,
even if from the horse’s mouth.

Don’t be sad, guys. Life is going on. New people will come, new ideas, new shhhtuff…

[DaveOC]

This article neatly dovetails with a lot of the sentiment set forth in the thread I started here:


Will Solstice/Sky production start up again?

[Fformula88]

Originally Posted by CHEVYSOL Nobody knows what is going to happen. Not even the highest management. LeNeve himself might not be there at the end of this week. We have to wait until March to make out a trend, a possible tendency, a drift. Until then any opinion, optimistic or otherwise, will be just blah-blah-blah, even if from the horse’s mouth. Don’t be sad, guys. Life is going on. New people will come, new ideas, new shhhtuff…

You seem to like throwing cold water onto the threads discussing these issues.

Of course things can change. We all know that. In fact, that is the case in the best of times too.

However, this is a discussion forum, specifically related to the Solstice. This is news which pertains to the Solstice. If it changes in a day, week, month, year, we will discuss the changes. Until then, what we have is what is out there now.

[LowLife1]

“Pontiac simply lost that excitement; it totally lost its way.”
It's kind of weird to hear someone talk about Pontiac as if it was a person. It's kind of like blaming the victim, If Pontiac fails, it would be more honest to say, management allowed Pontiac to fail. But managements never been too good at admitting its mistakes, but seems to be good at shifting the blame to somewhere else.

[MomsSol]

Originally Posted by LowLife1 “Pontiac simply lost that excitement; it totally lost its way.” It's kind of weird to hear someone talk about Pontiac as if it was a person. It's kind of like blaming the victim, If Pontiac fails, it would be more honest to say, management allowed Pontiac to fail. But managements never been too good at admitting its mistakes, but seems to be good at shifting the blame to somewhere else.

Seems to be the trend everywhere these days ... "Its not my fault" is the new mantra.

[WWI Flying Ace]

Why not 2 models? That would still qualify as "niche"...Solstice roadster and coupe, and the line of G8s...that would be the perfect Poncho niche lineup IMHO.

[Fformula88]

Originally Posted by WWI Flying Ace Why not 2 models? That would still qualify as "niche"...Solstice roadster and coupe, and the line of G8s...that would be the perfect Poncho niche lineup IMHO.

They are comparing it to Corvette being a standalone brand within Chevy.

Well, is there really a need to have a $30K RWD sedan as a stand alone brand? What makes the G8 so special as to deserve that? It is a quality RWD performance sedan, but it's still just a 4 door sedan with a big engine. Not exactly the same thing as a 'Vette IMO.

[SlyCoupe]

No one knows what's going to happen with Pontiac. But right now all GM is doing is just feeding the press information that probably has no merit just for publicity.

Why even keep Pontiac if you're only going to sell one car? Even if you offer maybe a few variants of it? That's stupid. You may as well kill off Pontiac as a whole and hand the Holden Commodore over to Chevy and bring back the Lumina or something.

Here's my hypothesis of what's going to happen. Pontiac is going to down size there's now question about it. They are going to keep their pitch about selling cars that are performance oriented and made for excitement. What will more than likely happen is that GM will kill of all the vehicles in Pontiac that are re-badges/shared platforms with Chevy (Pontiac Torrent, Pontiac G5, maybe the Grand Prix) and keep around the G8, G6, Solstice, maybe even the Vibe and limit it to a small offering of vehicles.

I just can't believe GM is letting Pontiac come out with the G3 (The Aveo) now that's a stupid move...

[Small Dealer]

Here is another version of the song.

Pontiac could be a one-car brand Rick Kranz Automotive News | December 15, 2008 DETROIT — The Pontiac brand next decade may be trimmed to one nameplate — or it could have as many as three. "We need to skinny it up, get it very focused and then create a very special role for Pontiac within the BPG channel," said Susan Docherty, vice president of Buick-Pontiac-GMC. "But it needs to be with a very focused entry or entries." Pontiac now has six nameplates. This month, General Motors submitted a recovery plan to Congress, revealing a lesser role for Pontiac in the next decade. GM will reduce the number of companywide nameplates to 40 by 2012, from 48 today. "We are not going to spend tons of money on product development" for Pontiac, Docherty said. GM's product development dollars will go to its four core brands — Buick, Cadillac, Chevrolet and GMC, she said. Instead, Pontiac may rely on an import or imports such as the G8, assembled by GM's Holden subsidiary in Australia. "The Pontiac G8 is a perfect example," she said. "With a minimal amount of investment, we are able to have a unique entry." To distinguish Pontiac, Docherty said Pontiac and Buick should have separate vehicle architectures. Sharing architectures "would not fill the mission of what we said in the long-term viability plan, of (Pontiac) being very focused, very specialty or niche." Pontiac will continue to market six models in 2009. The Torrent crossover will be dropped, but the G3 subcompact will be added. Nameplates will die in the following years. Docherty said none of Pontiac's nameplates is safe: "I would tell you that the white board is clean. Anybody that tells you that we got this thing figured out today, exactly what it's going to be, the answer to that is, no."

[MomsSol]

Docherty said none of Pontiac's nameplates is safe: "I would tell you that the white board is clean. Anybody that tells you that we got this thing figured out today, exactly what it's going to be, the answer to that is, no."

This ONE statement says it all IMO!

[Fformula88]

Originally Posted by SlyCoupe No one knows what's going to happen with Pontiac. But right now all GM is doing is just feeding the press information that probably has no merit just for publicity. Why even keep Pontiac if you're only going to sell one car? Even if you offer maybe a few variants of it? That's stupid. You may as well kill off Pontiac as a whole and hand the Holden Commodore over to Chevy and bring back the Lumina or something. Here's my hypothesis of what's going to happen. Pontiac is going to down size there's now question about it. They are going to keep their pitch about selling cars that are performance oriented and made for excitement. What will more than likely happen is that GM will kill of all the vehicles in Pontiac that are re-badges/shared platforms with Chevy (Pontiac Torrent, Pontiac G5, maybe the Grand Prix) and keep around the G8, G6, Solstice, maybe even the Vibe and limit it to a small offering of vehicles. I just can't believe GM is letting Pontiac come out with the G3 (The Aveo) now that's a stupid move...

I would disagree with this. I don't think GM is just floating false information around. The day they started combining Buick, Pontiac, and GMC dealers a couple years ago was their first move towards reducing nameplates in each brand. Doing so is not a new idea, it is a standing plan that is probably going to speed up now.

In reference to the kappa.... it's not dead yet but it has a lot of negatives for a struggling company. It requires a dedicated plant, is a loss leader, was intended to be a halo for a brand that is now being minimized, and has seen it's sales and demand fall off a cliff. (so little demand the plant will effectively be shut down for nearly 4 months straight when it is currently scheduled to re-open).

When the corporation has already burned all the furniture just to stay warm in the winter, and it is still cold out, they will start burning anything else they can afford to spare to survive. I just hope it doesn''t come to that for kappa, but the platform just doesn't make much economic sense for GM either, other than to try and recover development costs already invested.

As for the one plan/platform issue, it makes more sense than you think. If you view Buick/Pontiac/GMC as the same type of dealer network as Chevy. You don't need a full line for any one of the brands when all are sold out of the same store. Buick can be bigger, fancier cars, GMC peddling trucks/SUV's, and Pontiac smaller and/or sportier offerings. Maybe one, two nameplates for Pontiac, 2-3 for Buick, etc.

[Fformula88]

PS, GM planning to sell a quarter of it's heritage collection is another clear sign that they are getting desperate for cash, and anything is free game.

Some GM Heritage Cars to be auctioned at Barrett Jackson...a couple Sols in there

They wouldn't think to let go of these treasures unless they felt their backs are really against the wall.

[ChrisBlair]

Well, they don't make any GTO Judges or Can Ams or Grand Prix SJs or Swiss Cheese Catalinas any more either.

if Pontiac stopped offering the SOlstice, what's to say that for example Chevy wouldn't offer it? Happened with the Tracker; it was originally marketed as a Geo, remember?