Saw a Dodge Challenger up close, PICTURES

[Fformula88]

Originally Posted by StevieG Maybe. I don't know for sure. What I do know is the 2004 GTOs and the guys who paid $10K over sticker for those got fleeced big time. I wanted one badly, til I saw it in person. Then, I laughed over 3 years as I was called repeatedly by the stealership salesman who initially tried to fleece me, he called from 2004 til 2007 trying to sell me a GTO. Last an 06 for 8K below sticker. Notice, I do not have and have never owned this last generation GTO.

Those poor guys who paid $10K over for the GTO. Over the winter after they were released, dealers were selling them for nearly $10K OFF sticker.

The only salvation is that those 04's still seem to sell for the high teens, so after the initial depreciation, they didn't go and hit rock bottom. However, original owners would have had to hold onto them!

[kwtoxman]

Yup, I knew this already. The camaro with the decent engine is soo much lighter at 3860.

Both of those cars are compromises being built on such large platforms. Heaavvvy

[StevieG]

Originally Posted by kwtoxman Yup, I knew this already. The camaro with the decent engine is soo much lighter at 3860. Both of those cars are compromises being built on such large platforms. Heaavvvy

At 300 to 350 lbs lighter the Camaro represents much less of a compromise. Even so, the Zeta platform was heavily modified for this mission vs that of the G8 and its large sedan offspring. The Camaro is truer to its ponycar roots than is the Challenger. Both are larger than this current generation Mustang and rest assured, Ford will revamp the next generation with IRS and much more modern amenities to compete favorably. The short lived and short expected ponycar wars are on...

[Lumix]

After I read this thread, I went out to dinner with a friend and saw one on the road myself. Silver w/black. Nice...I like it...maybe even enough to buy one in a couple of years. There was also a silver dodge charger right behind it. Had I never seen the challenger OR THE CHARGER...I might choose the charger straight up. They both look great.
Reminded me of the camero/firebird relationship. Different...but the same. -Lumix

[kwtoxman]

The lighter versions of the camaro will suffer in the hp/lb ratio compared to the SS with 400+ hp. It may handle better, but the solstice GXP will still be quicker and handle better than the lower model camaro's. I really want to like the camaro's; the looks are awesome but the weight sucks, blows, etc.

[Stealthy4]

Originally Posted by Fformula88 Those poor guys who paid $10K over for the GTO. Over the winter after they were released, dealers were selling them for nearly $10K OFF sticker. The only salvation is that those 04's still seem to sell for the high teens, so after the initial depreciation, they didn't go and hit rock bottom. However, original owners would have had to hold onto them!

The other big problem is dang insurance on the goats is stll twice as much as a vette!

Originally Posted by kwtoxman The lighter versions of the camaro will suffer in the hp/lb ratio compared to the SS with 400+ hp. It may handle better, but the solstice GXP will still be quicker and handle better than the lower model camaro's. I really want to like the camaro's; the looks are awesome but the weight sucks, blows, etc.

I just saw something on yahoo that said "...4000 pounds of new is the 3000 pounds of old..."

I know the government is mandating all kinds of crap for roll over protection...hell, A-pillars are so wide now that they almost create more of a blind spot problem than they fix in a roll over...all that crap adds weight...(airbags, pretension seatbelts and buckles, front end structure, side impact structure....yadayadayada)

[AdamVIP]

The statistics on roll over deaths are super low too. I dont see the need for all this safety crap on cars. I wish it was all optional.

[Stealthy4]

As an engineer and an employee in the auto industry, i have two different takes on it.
1. It allows people to continue doing work and ultimately makes the car safer.
2. Its mandated by the federal government simply because people dont pay attention to their tire condition. Most roll overs are not in cars, but rather trucks and SUVs. and usually its the cause of a tire blow out and over-correction on the drivers part. Because of this pure neglegance, they mandate these HUGE A and B pillars, but now they want expensive tire pressure monitoring and stability control in ALL vehicles...and believe me those sensors for the stability and tires are very expensive and they add tons of electronic crap to the car...

[AztekzRpurty]

One question, if the owner wasn't there, who lifted the hood?

[SmokinSolstice]

Originally Posted by Stealthy4 The other big problem is dang insurance on the goats is stll twice as much as a vette!

Damn for real? I can't see why...the vette costs more and is faster.

[lil goat]

Originally Posted by AztekzRpurty One question, if the owner wasn't there, who lifted the hood?

He was there I just never found him, I am guessing he owns the Burger King as well, as the car was parked in the loading dock lane. The Burger King has a free car show every weekend all summer long, so I would guess the owner is a car guy.

[Stealthy4]

Originally Posted by SmokinSolstice Damn for real? I can't see why...the vette costs more and is faster.

Younger kids usualy cant afford them so there are less people out there doing crazy things with them...its very significant...all the small cars are very expensive...cobalt, focus, G5, Scion....

[66cat389]

Originally Posted by StevieG Maybe. I don't know for sure. What I do know is the 2004 GTOs and the guys who paid $10K over sticker for those got fleeced big time. I wanted one badly, til I saw it in person. Then, I laughed over 3 years as I was called repeatedly by the stealership salesman who initially tried to fleece me, he called from 2004 til 2007 trying to sell me a GTO. Last an 06 for 8K below sticker. Notice, I do not have and have never owned this last generation GTO.

I don't know what that salesman was really trying to sell you, Pontiac stopped making the GTO in 1974. And there hasn't been one since...

(Yeah, I know..... denial isn't just a river in Egypt..)

I'm still on the fence about the Challenger, it looks too bulky for my taste. It looks like it needs all of that power just to get that bulk moving. I'm more a fan of shoving a powerhouse engine into a light car, not unlike the 64 and 65 GTO.

Then again, I've never been a fan of Dodge.

[AztekzRpurty]

Originally Posted by 66cat389 I don't know what that salesman was really trying to sell you, Pontiac stopped making the GTO in 1974. And there hasn't been one since... (Yeah, I know..... denial isn't just a river in Egypt..) I'm still on the fence about the Challenger, it looks too bulky for my taste. It looks like it needs all of that power just to get that bulk moving. I'm more a fan of shoving a powerhouse engine into a light car, not unlike the 64 and 65 GTO. Then again, I've never been a fan of Dodge.

It's o.k. to be in denial, but it's not o.k. to include 73's and 74's as GTO's..

[lil goat]

I guess you wouldn't call these 2 2004's GTO's but I wouldn't mess with either one. The Silver one is putting 400 hp on the ground, the white one about 760 hp.