Supercharger vs gxp

[BADMONITO76]

Originally Posted by Randy@ddmworks not officially. Price not set yet

any expected date?

[Heliosky77]

Originally Posted by BADMONITO76 is the stage 3 out? how much is it? im interested but gotta save some more pennies

I have the pennies, just waiting on the specs.

[Randy@ddmworks]

Originally Posted by BADMONITO76 any expected date?

Well considering we have a customer coming in in a few weeks...we better have the last pieces together

The test mule(my car with the Stage 3 on it) is out being driven my one of our customers for the next week. If she doesn't kill it, I think things will come together quickly.

[jrsno1fan]

Originally Posted by Randy@ddmworks The test mule(my car with the Stage 3 on it) is out being driven by one of our customers for the next week. If she doesn't kill it, I think things will come together quickly.

If this car can stand up to me driving it for a week then it's sure bet you've got a winner on your hands. For those that don't know me, I drive fast and I drive hard! If anyone ever wanted a test a vehicle to see how it would hold up just give it to me for a week. In 3 years of owning Sols I've blown thru 1 tranny, 6 rearends, 2 injectors, 1 clutch, and 2 sets of brakes on 3 differents Sols.

As for voiding the warranty - I knew that going into this project but I also know and trust the guys at DDM. Having them as my mechanics to me is better then the warranty.

[Nazar]

Only in my dreams...
DDM, may be you want to open a few garages in Ukraine?
Here is really nice - insane roads, freaks who likes to gain up to 400HP on their 1.5L engines, girls, another stuff...

[bun1t]

Originally Posted by Randy@ddmworks c A GXP with an aftermerket tune has the same warranty as a S/C'd one. Besides if your worried about te warranty...don't mod the car. and the only difference in the bottom end is the crank...which GM rates the 2.4 crank up to 500hp...well beyond the scope of this discussion

A stage 1 S/C base runs about the same as a stock GXP, same performance but only one will still have a warranty. The GM tune boosts performance significantly and retains the factory warranty.

The LNF may share similar internals but the LNF has stronger cylinder walls and bigger cooling jackets. Not too mention the LE5 has a 10.4:1 c/r. Not very boost friendly, especially when you're dealing with the heat from a roots s/c.

[Critterman]

Heat from the S/C? My intake air is 2 degrees above ambient at a cruise, drops when I go WOT. That's what that big intercooler is for, keep the heat out.

[carcollector]

What are the risks of installing a SC?
Has anyone had any trouble or problems with it?

[Randy@ddmworks]

Originally Posted by bun1t A stage 1 S/C base runs about the same as a stock GXP, same performance but only one will still have a warranty. The GM tune boosts performance significantly and retains the factory warranty.

Adding a S/C will not void your entire warranty...matter of fact it does not automatically void your warranty. But if you modify your vehicle in ANY way other that FACTORY(any aftermarket...INCLUDING GMPP) you risk a denial of warranty service for that specific failure, provided the manufacturer/dealer can prove at their expense the failure was directly related to the modification. Yes it's a hassle and you will get the run around, but the law is on our side. If you get really specific, the warranties read to the effect: any alteration of the vehicle systems from the state it left the factory is considered a modification. That means the GMPP stuff (CAI, Exhaust, and Tune) technically could cause a denial of service. Do I think it will happen , probably not. but I've heard and experienced similar stupidity when it comes to warranty work.

Originally Posted by bun1t The LNF may share similar internals but the LNF has stronger cylinder walls and bigger cooling jackets. Not too mention the LE5 has a 10.4:1 c/r. Not very boost friendly, especially when you're dealing with the heat from a roots s/c.

The LNF and LE5 are both Ecotec-Family 2 - GEN 2 blocks. they are the same. The cooling jackets are the same. The cylinder sleeve walls are different, but that is only due to the LE5 having a larger bore. The internal bore is different but the outer sleeve diameter remains the same. The block casting are the same design. They both have low drag, high silica cast aluminum pistons, they both have forged connecting rods(powdered metal). The LE5 has a nodular iron crank rated by GM to 500 hp. The LNF has a forged crank, I haven't seen a rating on it.

On a side note, I only know of two block failures in kappas. both were LNFs. And one of those was due to a 300hp non-progressive nitrous shot.

As far as CR and heat from a Eaton Gen4 S/C . 10.4 is not that high on a modern all aluminum engine. The Stage 1 DDMWorks kits runs a very safe low boost of 5ish PSI. This does two things, one it puts the output of the blower in a "sweet spot" on it's adiabatic efficiency (low heat generation), and it keeps the cylinder pressure at a manageable level since this is a non-intercooled system.

Our kit's safety record speaks for itself. They have been installed on Kappas for two years now. There have been NO engine failures or damage on S/C'd cars. The worst result we've have are a few twisted belts..now fixed, and black tailpipes. oh and lots of hurt faces from the permagrin

[nighttripper]

What happens when you want to upgrade and run more than 5psi to compete with a nicely modded GXP? That 10.4 c/r is going to need higher octane very quickly. A s/c is great for the people who already have a base model but to recommend that over a GXP is a bit of a stretch.[/QUOTE ]

Depends if you like factory turbos or upgrading to a aftermarket S/C or Turbo, and the mods you want to perform. I personally, just me, would rather go with the base model and put the extra money into a long term upgrades of my 2.4. After all with the GXP or Redline, if I had one, I'd be upgrading it too.

[AZDarkSol]

Originally Posted by nighttripper What happens when you want to upgrade and run more than 5psi to compete with a nicely modded GXP? That 10.4 c/r is going to need higher octane very quickly. A s/c is great for the people who already have a base model but to recommend that over a GXP is a bit of a stretch.[/QUOTE ] Depends if you like factory turbos or upgrading to a aftermarket S/C or Turbo, and the mods you want to perform. I personally, just me, would rather go with the base model and put the extra money into a long term upgrades of my 2.4. After all with the GXP or Redline, if I had one, I'd be upgrading it too.

Besides I like the looks of the base better anyway (more like the original concept) I.M.O.

When I chose the base model I knew I could boost it when I wanted with proven SC mod technology and I would be boosting a larger displacement engine. This base Ecotec engine by design "incorporated provisions for added technologies such as turbocharging, supercharging, piston oil cooling, dual cam phasing and direct fuel injection. These add-ons were envisioned for future applications" (quote from The Pontiac Solstice Book page 49 regarding the Ecotec 2.4 liter VVT)

To mod or not to mod that is question. If my intent was never to mod and stay with 100% factory, I would have bought the GXP.

[Randy@ddmworks]

Originally Posted by bun1t What happens when you want to upgrade and run more than 5psi to compete with a nicely modded GXP? That 10.4 c/r is going to need higher octane very quickly. A s/c is great for the people who already have a base model but to recommend that over a GXP is a bit of a stretch.

If you want to go more than 5 psi, you go with Stage 2.

An intercooler, and a smaller pulley delivering 8-9 PSI. and then your in that league. The technology is proven and has been out there for a while. ANY forced induction vehicle should be running Premium gas.

Supercharging is not an inferior technology like many people assume. It's just a different way to do it. It yeilds different benefits that some people prefer, and others may not. We like the turbo as well, but i comes down to it's just a completely different feel and driving characteristic

[Randy@ddmworks]

Originally Posted by bun1t A supercharger won't void your entire warranty, but it it will void the important things, power and drivetrain. You will also have a lot easier time getting your car fixed with a factory installed upgrade than you will with an aftermarket supercharger. GM is going broke, if they can find a reason to not fix your car, they will deny you service.

The GMPP stage kit is not considered a factory installed upgrade. It is a dealer installed item. It may sound trivial, but it is not. for it to be factory installed, it would have to leave Wilmington with the stage kit already on it.
GMPP parts carry a 12month/12000miles warranty on the parts themselves, but they are considered aftermarket parts. If I were doing the kit on my car, I would require a GM official to put into writing that the kit would not interfere with ANY warranty service or claims.

[Jackknife]

What all this means is before you consider ANY mod think responsibility.

You're the consumer...you take the risk. Gather information, be informed.

Recognize that sometimes you have to pay to play.

Don't expect the manufacturer to back your play.

If it's too costly do your risky business elsewhere, but remember life doesn't

come with a warranty. Businesses fail, marriages fail, health fails...

Pick your poison...pay your bills.

I consider myself one of the lucky ones, so far...I can take a chance on

DDM.

[Chemist]

Originally Posted by Jackknife What all this means is before you consider ANY mod think responsibility. You're the consumer...you take the risk. Gather information, be informed. Recognize that sometimes you have to pay to play. Don't expect the manufacturer to back your play. If it's too costly do your risky business elsewhere, but remember life doesn't come with a warranty. Businesses fail, marriages fail, health fails... Pick your poison...pay your bills. I consider myself one of the lucky ones, so far...I can take a chance on DDM.

Well stated, jackknife.

I timed my trip to DDM to coincide with the expiration of my warranty. It's on my dime now.