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Manual Trans.-second gear grind

17K views 60 replies 28 participants last post by  Bebop2 
#1 ·
Since new, the manual transmission grinds when shifting to second gear. I took it to the dealer at about 250 miles and left it over night. They could reproduce the grind, but stated that no fix existed. Several thousand miles later the trans still grinds into second. The condition only exists during ambient temperature conditions, summer, fall, spring, winter. Once the trans warms up, it shifts fine. Searching other threads on the manual trans revealed that this JAPANESE transmission uses 90 weight gear lube. I think the heavy gear lube is causing the syncro to balk. My 84 S10 manual used 10W30 motor oil for lube. My 89 Borg Warner T5 had ATF for lube. I can't believe that 90 weight gear lube is necessary in a modern manual trans. I would love to drain the gear box and fill it with 10W30 Mobil One synthetic for a test, but am concerned about voiding the warranty. No one at GM or the dealerships seem to have a fix. Anyone else having an issue with second gear??
 
#3 ·
Common.. my 06 was worse than my 07 GXP, but still present. Higher rpm s and warmer temp eliminate the problem..

what to say... what to say.. :yawn:
 
#4 ·
second is fine for me, its the 2 to 3...click shift gets me. You have push it in or wait for it to go in smoothly.

I plan on going synthetic at 10k, which should take care of the cold shifts.
 
#5 ·
find a factory equivalent synthetic gear oil and it will probably fix the problem. I changed out all the gear boxes on my Ranger and it made a huge difference when cold. It used to refuse to shift after sitting out all night in -5 degrees. Not with the synthetic though.
 
#6 ·
Thanks to all for the timely replies! I'm going to dump the 90W and go with a thinner synthetic. I'll stop off at the local parts store tomorrow and see what they have. I'll post again if it helped or not. I hope the syncro is not totally destroyed.
 
#12 · (Edited)
I get a little bit of that second gear grind. To me, it feels like the clutch is not fully disengaging. Along with that symptom, I also can feel the car lunge a little if I shift it into first from neutral with the brakes applied, standing still, when cold. Kinda like the driveline is loading up a little bit. Again, it feels like the clutch is not fully disengaging. I have never felt that from a standard before.

I have a Mazda truck that was grinding into second when cold, and it was because the clutch wasn't fully disengaging, due to a bad slave cylinder.
 
#13 ·
In your response you mentioned getting a "thinner synthetic" Actually you probably want to get the same weight synthetic. The advantages of the synthetic are the sheer strength, low temperature performance and film strength.

Once the synthetic has coated all the moving parts, it leaves a film there that does not drain off and leave the potential for any metal to metal contact.

When the gearbox is "cold" the synthetic does not thicken up and resist movement like non synthetic lubricants can.
 
#15 ·
Anybody done a change of the transmission oil? I would like to know the procedure. I have already changed out my rear differential to synthetic Amsoil with the LSD additive.
 
#16 ·
Theres always gotta be someone throwing the wrench in the works but I live in Ohio and have been driving my car all through winter. (its been mild,but still cold) I usually warm it up for a few minutes before I leave, but no grinds here. Maybe lucky I guess. My Fiat trannys used to take a viscous oil, but that was back in the 70's and 80's. Once we knew better, we switched them out to ATF or Castrol 10w/30 and they shifted much better so you may be on the right track. Keep us posted on your results if you try it. Good luck...
 
#17 ·
Off to the corner repair shop I go tomorrow morning to have the 90W drained and 10W30 Mobil 1 installed! I also had it to the dealer a week ago for a leaking differential. They put a new seal in and sent me on my way. Guess what I got in the mail today.........a recall notice stating that my rear differential seal is defective, will leak, and I should take it in! At least they (GM) are on top of parts that don't function properly. One would think with all the testing that this issue would have been noticed. (Same with the 2nd gear syncro.)
 
#18 ·
quincy said:
Searching other threads on the manual trans revealed that this Japanese transmission uses 90 weight gear lube.
No it doesn't.

Fluid specs call for Manual Transmission Fluid API AI-A or GL-3 SAE 75W-90


quincy said:
I would love to drain the gear box and fill it with 10W30 Mobil One synthetic for a test, but am concerned about voiding the warranty.
Would not void the warranty. Improper Maintenance would just mean that any failure would not be covered unter the warranty.

quincy said:
Off to the corner repair shop I go tomorrow morning to have the 90W drained and 10W30 Mobil 1 installed!
Don't forget that the drain plug washer and fluid fill plug washer must be replaced each time.

Also careful with the Heated O2 Sensor wiring when the exhaust is dropped. And watch out for the vehicle speed sensor wiring too. A site member damaged the wiring last week during a fluid change and had all sorts or funny dash isssues.
 
#34 ·
No it doesn't.

Fluid specs call for Manual Transmission Fluid API AI-A or GL-3 SAE 75W-90

According to Royal Purple's website: Cars that require API GL-3 75W90 (Solstice) or 80W90 Manual Transmission oil may use their SAE 10W40 / XPR 10W40 oils instead.

Small Dealer - Royal Purple states that their SAE 10W40 /XPR 10W40 is equal to GL-3. Could changing to RP become a warranty issue if there is a failure since it is GL-3 equivalent. What about the amsoil synchromesh manual transmission fluid?
 
#19 · (Edited)
lloydgbrown said:
Anybody done a change of the transmission oil? I would like to know the procedure.
This maybe the thread with the most info.


http://www.solsticeforum.com/forum/f43/changing-manual-tranny-oil-39431/


Here they are:

Transmission Fluid Replacement

Draining Procedure

1) Raise and support the vehicle.

2) Remove the front floor closeout panel.

3) Clean away all dirt and debris from the transmission fluid drain plug area.

4) Position an appropriate container under the transmission.

5) Remove the transmission fluid drain plug and washer.

6) Discard the washer.

7) Allow the transmission fluid to drain into the container.

8) Install the transmission fluid drain plug and NEW washer. Tighten the drain plug to 37 N·m (27 lb ft).

9) Remove the container used to catch the used transmission fluid from under the vehicle.

Filling Procedure

1) Clean away all dirt and debris from the transmission fluid fill plug area.

2) Remove the transmission fluid fill plug and washer.

3) Discard the washer.

4) Fill the transmission to just below the bottom of the fill plug hole with the recommended fluid. Refer to Lubrication Specifications .

5) Install the transmission fluid fill plug and NEW washer. Tighten the fill plug to 37 N·m (27 lb ft).

6)Install the front floor closeout panel.

7) Lower the vehicle.


Floor Panel Tunnel Panel Replacement - Front (Manual Transmission)


Preliminary Procedures

A) Raise the vehicle.

B) Remove the exhaust system pipe.

Procedures

1) Remove Front Tunnel Panel Bolts (Qty: 9)

2) Reinstall Front Tunnel Panel Bolts (Qty: 9)

3) Tighten to 9 N·m (80 lb in)


Muffler Replacement

Removal Procedure

1) Open the hood.

2) Remove the connector position assurance (CPA) retainer.

3) Disconnect the heated oxygen sensor (HO2S) electrical connector.

4) Raise and suitably support the vehicle.

Important: The HO2S uses a permanently attached pigtail and connector. This pigtail should not be removed from the sensor. Damage or removal of the pigtail or connector will affect proper operation of the sensor.

5) Remove the catalytic converter to muffler nuts.

6) Have an assistant support the muffler assembly.

7) Separate the muffler insulators from the hangers.

8) With the aid of an assistant, remove the muffler assembly.

Installation Procedure

1) With the aid of an assistant, position the muffler assembly.

2) Install the muffler insulators onto the hangers.

3) Install the catalytic converter to muffler nuts. Tighten the nuts to 17 N·m (13 lb ft).

4) Lower the vehicle.

5) Connect the HO2S electrical connector.

6) Install the CPA retainer.

7) Close the hood.
 
#20 ·
Try pulling the shift lever straight back from 1st to 2nd, it's much smoother. My car can grind when I put a little pressure on the shifter to the left while pulling back.

The funny thing is that my previous cars, all FWD with cable activated shifters, all required a little pressure to the left in order to shift smoothly from 1st to 2nd.
 
#22 ·
Instead of Mobil 1, I purchased three quarts of Amsoil 5W30 synthetic Synchromesh Transmission Oil. The local garage let me under the vehicle while we drained the fluid. (Very rare in todays insursance driven world). I was very surprised and pleased to see such a robust undercarriage! The trans has a thick metal shield under it. The prop shaft is also 100% enclosed by a heavy metal stamping. This is on top of a very thick floor pan and full length frame! Small Dealer, we did not drop the exhaust system. One bolt took a while to snake out, but I think the time spent would still be less than dropping and then reinstalling the exhaust pipe. Drained the OEM lube out. Took a sample in my hand, no bronze fines in the oil; which is good news. The upper drain plug is difficult to get to, but the mechanic had a vintage brass suction device to suck the new oil from the bottle and then insert it into the trans. It took just under three quarts to fill the gear box. I did not change the oil plug washers as you described, and hope I do not regret it. Yes the rear end is manufactured by Getrag, a German company of good reputation. We buttoned everything up and off I went. The reduced shift effort was immediatly noticed. Smooth and sliky. No grinds in second gear. The car is cold soaking in the garage right now, so tomorrow morning will be the 'acid test'. If this works as expected, someone should contact GM and let them know about the oil swap. Wish me luck!
 
#23 ·
I have the occasional 2nd gear grind. I though it was just me...meaning my (in)ability to shift into 2nd properly. I guess not.
 
#24 ·
According to Royal Purple's website: Cars that require API GL-3 75W90 (Solstice) or 80W90 Manual Transmission oil may use their SAE 10W40 / XPR 10W40 oils instead.

Cars that require API GL-4 or 5 manual transmission oils must use their 75W90 or higher gear oils.

Am I reading their chart correctly?

Also, if it's okay for one to operate their manual transmission with 10W/40 synthetic oil, would the factory service life instructions apply or should one change their transmission oil at much shorter service intervals?
 
#26 ·
This is the response I got back from my email last night to Royal Purple:

We just got finished racing with the Solstice and we were running XPR 5w20 motor oil, but this was for race only.

A 75w90 and a 10w40 motor oil have very similar viscosities so you are not changing it that much and with our film strength you are not losing any protection, but gaining it. Like you have already found RP 10w40 or XPR 10w40 would be our recommendations for a GL-3 75w90. We recommend RP 10w40 for your manual transmission, but if you are looking for the best in protection our XPR 10w40 would be the way to go.

As for the oil change intervals, because you are still under warranty we recommend staying with the factory recommendations to avoid any problems with the dealer over warranty.


Looks like there is nothing to loose and some gain with an early transmission oil swap!
 
#28 ·
OK, official update time. I wanted to drive the week in our sub zero weather to give the fluid change a good test. Results. Shift improvement by 90%! It still balks once in awhile going into second, but usually only once or twice a day (going to and comming from work after a cold soak). I can say without a doubt that the fluid change has helped the issue and as a side benefit the rest of the gears shift silky smooth. So, although it did not cure my problem 100% (must be a damaged spot on the speed gear syncro teeth that I hit) I can say I am very pleased and highly recommend the fluid change. Please follow 'Small Delears' recommendations if you decide to try a lighter oil.
 
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