No Start Issue! - Pontiac Solstice Forum
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post #1 of 35 (permalink) Old 12-29-2018, 03:00 PM Thread Starter
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No Start Issue!

My 2008 2.4L is having a failure to start issue. It has had the problem off and on of a really slow start (engine turns over very slowly and eventually starts). However, this week the problem changed and I haven't been able to figure it out. Here are the conditions:

1. The battery is fully charged, pretty new (3 months), and test at two different locations.
2. I've checked the grounds in the engine bay and all are good contact.
3. I've swapped out several relays in the fuse box on the run/crank positions.
4. I've done the key security reset procedure 3 times.
5. When the key is turned on, the security light comes on for 4 seconds, then goes off. No other lights work on the dash. Gauge lights, warning lights, etc. The info LED panel reads Solstice, then goes to Service Air Bag.
6. After attempting to start, dash lights go back to the same accept the gauge needles cycle.
7. The car was at a body shop last week for a rear bumper replacement. I assume the battery was unhooked for a while.
8. The day I picked it up it started slowly for a while, then developed the current condition.

Need to note: this car was a rebuild. It was hit in the right front and straightened/repaired before I bought it. I do not believe it was under water, however, it could have been sitting outside for a while. It also did not have a splash shield installed when I got it.

What could be causing this? Are there grounding points I've missed? Is the BCM dead? Any suggestions would be appreciated!

2006 2.4L
Water damaged from an insurance sale.
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post #2 of 35 (permalink) Old 12-29-2018, 04:28 PM
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Is starting slowly, slow to turn over or spins well but takes a long time to start.
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post #3 of 35 (permalink) Old 12-29-2018, 04:38 PM
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I'm curious about the note in your signature that says: "Water damaged ..." What exactly do you mean by that, when you say it wasn't underwater?
Also, what splash shield was missing?

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post #4 of 35 (permalink) Old 12-29-2018, 05:27 PM Thread Starter
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Sometimes when starting, it would take 3-4 seconds from turning the key to the start position to start cranking/turning over. It would start rotating slowly, like it was a not getting much voltage to the starter. Once it started it would run just fine.

2006 2.4L
Water damaged from an insurance sale.
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post #5 of 35 (permalink) Old 12-29-2018, 05:35 PM Thread Starter
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I think it was outside in the weather. The interior really seemed like it was water damaged. It's possible it was in the dash too. I'm wondering if this got water into the BCM or the connectors and resulted in corrosion or failure.

The splash shield is the "underbody" plastic piece most cars under the engine bay. Maybe the Solstice never had those?

2006 2.4L
Water damaged from an insurance sale.
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post #6 of 35 (permalink) Old 12-29-2018, 05:44 PM
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Not that I'm aware of. Neither has any other vehicle I have owned for that matter.
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post #7 of 35 (permalink) Old 12-30-2018, 09:51 AM
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If it has "water damage " chances are you have corrosion somewhere in your electrical connections which will take time to develop .At this point your only recourse if that's the problem would be to start disconnecting the connections I would start at the BCM and clean them up with a good electrical contact cleaner and add some insurance with dielectric grease ,this is the common problem with a flood car Good Luck !
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post #8 of 35 (permalink) Old 12-30-2018, 10:47 AM Thread Starter
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Another thing I noticed this morning. The ODBII port doesn’t have power. It normally powers up the scanner, but it isn’t doing that now. Does that power come from the ECU or the BCM?

2006 2.4L
Water damaged from an insurance sale.
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post #9 of 35 (permalink) Old 12-30-2018, 03:38 PM
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(Apologies for the disorganized post - these are just my thoughts as they came to me while considering the problem.)

If it was a security system problem, the light would stay on. It lights up temporarily to show you that the light is working. That is normal.

The OBD2 port is fused. Does your accessory outlet, (aka, the cigarette lighter jack) have power? They share a fuse. I typically just plug in my phone charger and see if the light comes on to check these.

The OBD2 port connects to the ECM through the harness, but power for the port does not, IIRC. I don't have the service manual with me.

When the needles cycle on the cluster, it's a self-check that the cluster is performing. It doesn't have to talk to anything else to do that.

Normally, I'd say all of this sounds like a bad ground, or an intermittent / faulty negative battery connection. Have you looked at the battery terminals (and matching harness connections)? If it has water damage - or even if it didn't - then I could see some corrosion forming around there. BUT, you say you've checked all of the grounds:

1. Negative battery terminal.
2. One on the frame about a foot away from the negative battery terminal. 10mm bolt. (as are all of these)
3. Front of the cylinder head
4. Starter. (This one would make starting slow or just not work at all, but wouldn't cause issue with the cluster or diagnostic port)

The "service air bag" message indicates either a real issue with the air bags, OR a communication issue. For the airbags, this would be the BCM. That could indicate a break in the harness (VERY unlikely), a loose connector on ECM, BCM or cluster, a bad BCM or a disconnected airbag. (The airbag sensor recall issue will trigger the airbag light, but not in my experience a "service airbag" message.)

I suspect that the message is actually coming from the BCM, though, which would indicate that it's (at least mostly) working. :/ Someone else may jump in and correct me here.

Just for clarity: did you clear the message and see if another one pops up on the DIC?

I'd disconnect the BCM harness and check for power and ground. (The service manual will have pinouts.)

There's a big-ass harness connector near and below the engine bay fuse box - about 4" on a side, with a gray cam-lock type retainer - that I'd also check out.

The ECM is on the driver's side in the engine bay, near the windshield washer tank and under the coolant reservoir. Remove and reconnect the 2 or 3 (depends on the year and I don't know the cutoff) Large connectors, check for water, etc., and reconnect them.

But, going back to the OBD2 issue:

If the fuse is good, and you don't have power at the OBD2 port - I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you're checking the correct pins - then the ECM may be the issue. The ECM is what's on the other end of the harness from the OBD2 connector. HOWEVER, it should still have power, even if the ECM was disconnected. (Though, I haven't verified this recently, just working from memory from four years ago.) (It's also possible - pretty easy, actually - to accidentally push the connector pin receivers back into the connector, with a multimeter probe, so that they will touch the probe but not make a good connection with a scan tool connector.)

If this were my car, I'd start by tracking down the OBD2 issue as it has the fewest number of components involved. Check the ACC fuse - also, make sure that the cable bundle that goes into the bottom of the engine bay fuse box is REALLY connected (I spent a week tracking that one down after an engine swap), remove and reseat ALL fuses and relays, check for power at the cig lighter port.

Do the headlights work? Bright as they should be?

The factory service manual has some really great diagnostic procedures for this kind of thing.
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Blue-ish 2006 2.4, Werks stage 1 turbo, Borla cat-back, DDM braces, Spec aluminum flywheel, Spec stage 2 clutch, Werks aluminum radiator, some gauges, RKSport hood, Morimoto FX-Rs, GReddy Profec, Norm's fenders

'07 GXP, RPM Stage 2, Solocatless downpipe, TCE Wilwood 6 piston front brakes, 4-piston rears , Stainless brake lines, slotted/drilled rotors, BC Racing BR coilovers, Performance Autowerks intercooler, DDMWorks CAI, charge pipes and braces

Last edited by raygun; 12-30-2018 at 03:57 PM.
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post #10 of 35 (permalink) Old 12-30-2018, 09:18 PM
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check the battery terminals, if the terminals have corrosion clean or replace them
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post #11 of 35 (permalink) Old 12-30-2018, 09:49 PM
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I agree with checking the battery terminals and both ends of the cables that connect to each of them.

@raygun : The "Service Airbag" will display with a PPS problem (the subject of the recall).

John
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post #12 of 35 (permalink) Old 12-30-2018, 09:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnWR View Post
I agree with checking the battery terminals and both ends of the cables that connect to each of them.


@raygun : The "Service Airbag" will display with a PPS problem (the subject of the recall).


Really? Itís totally busted on my Ď06. I just get a light, no message on the DIC.


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Blue-ish 2006 2.4, Werks stage 1 turbo, Borla cat-back, DDM braces, Spec aluminum flywheel, Spec stage 2 clutch, Werks aluminum radiator, some gauges, RKSport hood, Morimoto FX-Rs, GReddy Profec, Norm's fenders

'07 GXP, RPM Stage 2, Solocatless downpipe, TCE Wilwood 6 piston front brakes, 4-piston rears , Stainless brake lines, slotted/drilled rotors, BC Racing BR coilovers, Performance Autowerks intercooler, DDMWorks CAI, charge pipes and braces
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post #13 of 35 (permalink) Old 12-30-2018, 09:54 PM
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I can't speak for an '06, but it does for an '07 and '08. I've done testing with both.

John
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post #14 of 35 (permalink) Old 01-01-2019, 05:25 PM Thread Starter
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UPDATE:
I got the dash issue sorted. It WAS in the fuse box. Apparently a bad connection in one of the main connectors. Most likely caused by me with trying to diagnose the starting issue. Confirmed voltage to the BCM and ECU as well. OBD port is working again. There are no error codes currently.

I checked every relay and fuse in the main fuse box as well as the BCM. Everything was functioning.

Still having the same issue. When I turn the key to start it does nothing. I confirmed there is voltage at the starter. I have not been able to bump(hammer) the starter while turning the ignition. My best guess at this point is that the starter or starter solenoid are bad.

2006 2.4L
Water damaged from an insurance sale.

Last edited by fullytweaked; 01-01-2019 at 05:32 PM. Reason: corrections
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post #15 of 35 (permalink) Old 01-02-2019, 12:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnWR View Post
I can't speak for an '06, but it does for an '07 and '08. I've done testing with both.
The message shows on an '06 as well ... at least it did on mine before I had the recall done.
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