good manual transmission fluid/oil? - Pontiac Solstice Forum
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post #1 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-11-2010, 11:22 AM Thread Starter
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good manual transmission fluid/oil?

What do you guys recommend for a good manual transmission fluid/oil for my 2008 saturn sky?

Royal purple synchromax?

Oem oil?

thanks!

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post #2 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-11-2010, 11:45 AM
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Synthetic...Royal Purple or Mobil1 are good. Amsoil if you want to spring for top-shelf.
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post #3 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-11-2010, 11:49 AM
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I run the RP synchromax been very happy, I run there ATF in my truck, and the cycle oil in my Harley, are you beginning to see a theme here.

By the way putting RP and Mobil 1 in the same category is just wrong, Mobil 1 is not 100% synthetic RP and Amsoil are, RP tends to put more anti-wear additives in there products than any other company.

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post #4 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-11-2010, 12:19 PM
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I may be wrong, but I believe our trannies required gear oil, which Syncromax is FAR from. I'm not near my books at the moment so if someone is that would be great!
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post #5 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-12-2010, 06:38 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lil goat View Post
I run the RP synchromax been very happy, I run there ATF in my truck, and the cycle oil in my Harley, are you beginning to see a theme here.

By the way putting RP and Mobil 1 in the same category is just wrong, Mobil 1 is not 100% synthetic RP and Amsoil are, RP tends to put more anti-wear additives in there products than any other company.
you didn't have any problems using RP synchromax?


after some research, I found out that our transmission uses 75w90.

RP synchromax is a lighter weight

RP max gear is 75w90.....which I will be using.....

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post #6 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-12-2010, 10:43 PM
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Pontiac Solstice Performance book says Mobil 1 75-90 synthetic for both the trans and diff.

GM (Service Info) says part number 89021806 75-90 dino oil. (But synthetic for the diff.)

The little I've researched on this subject leads to Amsoil Severe Gear as being pretty good, but a lot of that opinion is based on this... http://www.amsoil.com/lit/g2457.pdf
which no doubt is a little biased but I'm not sure they can cheat a whole lot on these tests.

Then there's some info saying don't use synthetic in this trans, not sure how serious of a problem it would be, I doubt it could hurt anything but then again these trannies are pretty bullet proof using the stock dino fluid. I've seen lots of problems using synthetic oils in dirtbikes (combined engine, clutch and trans oil) the clutches really don't like synthetic oil. Not sure what these syncros are made of, if they're metallic it shouldn't be a problem, if they're any kind of fiber synthetic oil could be a problem. (???, I'm NOT a trans tech so I'm not presuming to be any kind of expert on this subject.)

Here's some more for you... (from GM Techlink)

Quote:
Using the incorrect type of transmission fluid in Aisin manual transmissions may affect the sealing ability of the seals. An incorrect type of sealer may not be compatible with the transmission fluid or may not have the correct characteristics for sealing the affected components.

TIP: Refer to SI documentation for correct sealers, adhesives, lubricants and fill quantity for each transmission you service.

Aisin manual transmissions require the use of p/n 89021806 - Fluid, m/trns 75W-90 GL-3, 1QT (89021807, 1L, in Canada). The use of the correct fluid is required to assure the desired shift characteristics and compatibility with adhesive sealers.

RTV is the only sealer that is compatible with this fluid. The use of anaerobic sealers on Aisin manual transmissions is not recommended.
Mine's only got 26k on it, but I was still planning on changing it soon. I might just use the stock recommended fluid since there doesn't seem to be any problems that better or different oil would need to fix. The other factor is if I need to warrantee the trans or diff, having a receipt showing I serviced it with the recommended GM fluids would be better than having a GM rep seeing purple fluid in a broken trans or rear end. If I were to go non-oem oil I'd probably trust the Pontiac book saying Mobil 1 synthetic 75-90, second choice would be Amsoil Severe Gear. All 3 of those oils have a lot of reputation behind them that I would certainly trust. (Never been a big fan of Amsoil though.)

edit... found more info saying stay away from GL-5 gear oils for trans use, evidently it's easy on gears but hard on syncros. Amsoil synthetic trans fluid is GL-4 and looks like a better alternative for the trans than the Severe Gear oil. Something like the Severe Gear or GL-5 oils would be fine for the diff. I'm staying with GL-4 fluids for this trans. Mobil 1 Synthetic 75-90 is GL-5, maybe the Pontiac Performance book says it's ok for the trans since they really don't care about long term durability for a car that they're setting up for racing only.

I guess my conclusion is OEM or Amsoil Synthetic 75-90 trans/gear oil for the trans and Severe Gear for the diff. Doesn't look like it's worth going non-OEM for the diff since GM recommends their good synthetic gear oil anyway, but it might be worth trying the Amsoil Synthetic (or any other synthetic that doesn't say it's GL-5) for the trans.

BTW, Royal Purple Max is quite a bit higher viscosity than most of the others, even seems higher than what data sheets are saying 75-90 is supposed to be. Could be a problem shifting when cold. The Amsoil trans oil is quite a bit thinner but still right in there with what 75-90 is supposed to be. I didn't find a spec for the OEM dino 75-90, it would be nice to know how thick it actually is compared to these others. 75-90 isn't 75-90 in all brands, that's for sure. Royal Purple Syncromax is WAY thinner than what is recommended for this trans.

Last edited by gmtech16450yz; 06-13-2010 at 01:50 AM.
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post #7 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-14-2010, 10:25 AM
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I'm pretty sure that the GM Performance book has recommendations. I don't have my copy in front of me right now. They were giving them away like candy at NASSM

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post #8 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-18-2010, 05:00 AM
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The RP Syncromax has been in mine for over 30K, and I beat mine hard, 7200 rpm redline, it shifts better for sure. GM recommends Mobil for everything, it's called a paid endorsement, as one racing team sponsored by Mobil 1 put it, GM Mobil, same company different division. Mobil is insisting they run a Camaro next year, why should Mobil care? I will stick with RP, and 75-90 weight is the same for every brand! They don't get to decide what the weight is, those are cold then hot numbers and it is viscosity which is a heck of a lot more than how thick it is.

Check out what the Corvette folks think. I believe they are GM cars too. For Petes sake get outside the little Kappa a world and get a clue.
Royal Purple Syncromax to the rescue!! - Corvette Forum

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post #9 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-18-2010, 05:18 AM Thread Starter
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I love RP products. They never disappointed me.

But why use RP synchromax which is a lighter weight compared to stock oil (75w-90)?

if we can use RP max gear which is 75w-90?

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post #10 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-18-2010, 11:39 AM
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No reason you couldn't use Max-Gear, it is a heavier weight oil and is GL-4, GL-5. Never had a problem with the Synchromax, but the Aisin tranny might like the Max-Gear better, Synchromax is much better than stock, not saying the Max-Gear wouldn't be better. I like the lighter oil because we have a truck transmission, and I wanted the lighter feel, same tranny as a Colorado or Toyota pick up.
Just and FYI to really confuse everyone many modern gearboxes use a 75W90 gear oil, which is actually of equivalent viscosity to a 10W40 motor oil.
To explain the GL-4 Gl-5 thing it is a difference in anti-scuffing additives.

API classification subdivides all transmission oils into 6 classes:

* API GL-1, oils for light conditions. They consist of base oils without additives. Sometimes they contain small amounts of antioxidizing additives, corrosion inhibitors, depresants and antifoam additives. API GL-1 oils are designed for spiral-bevel, worm gears and manual transmissions without synchronizers in trucks and farming machines.
* API GL-2, oils for moderate conditions. They contain antiwear additives and are designed for worm gears. Recommended for proper lubrication of tractor and farming machine transmissions.
* API GL-3, oils for moderate conditions. Contain up to 2.7% antiwear additives. Designed for lubricating bevel and other gears of truck transmissions. Not recommended for hypoid gears.
* API GL-4, oils for various conditions - light to heavy. They contain up to 4.0% effective antiscuffing additives. Designed for bevel and hypoid gears which have small displacement of axes, the gearboxes of trucks, and axle units. Recommended for non-synchronized gearboxes of US trucks, tractors and buses and for main and other gears of all vehicles. These oils are basic for synchronized gearboxes, especially in Europe.
* API GL-5, oils for severe conditions. They contain up to 6.5% effective antiscuffing additives. The general application of oils in this class are for hypoid gears having significant displacement of axes. They are recommended as universal oils to all other units of mechanical transmission (except gearboxes). Oils in this class, which have special approval of vehicle manufacturers, can be used in synchronized manual gearboxes only. API GL-5 oils can be used in limited slip differentials if they correspond to the requirements of specification MIL-L-2105D or ZF TE-ML-05. In this case the designation of class will be another, for example API GL-5+ or API GL-5 LS.
* API GL-6, oils for very heavy conditions (high speeds of sliding and significant shock loadings). They contain up to 10% high performance antiscuffing additives. They are designed for hypoid gears with significant displacement of axes. Class API GL-6 is not applied any more as it is considered that class API GL-5 well enough meets the most severe requirements.

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post #11 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-18-2010, 04:00 PM
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Wow, lots of misinformation there, I'm not going to pick it apart except for what I would assume is an attack against me and my knowledge and experience.

Quote:
For Petes sake get outside the little Kappa a world and get a clue.
My world dates back to the '70's when I was working on an Indy 500 pit crew. The team I was working with had one of the first "stock block" Chevy engines to finish Indy. To say I've been a little outside the Kappa world would be like saying Tiger is a little into golf.

Lighten up on the personal attacks, I'm just contributing what I know and trying to learn new things at the same time. I think that's why sky888 asked the question, not to fight about who knows more about oil or who's run one particular oil in one particular car and decide it's the best. Did you know if you loose your brake fluid in your dirt bike racing out in the desert away from any support you can pee in the master to fill it back up? Evidently urine will work as brake fluid, that doesn't mean it's the right or best thing to use.
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post #12 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-18-2010, 04:48 PM
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BG Products Inc. Synchroshift (part#792) with 3oz. of BG MGC additive(part#325). This stuff is so good you can on occassion get seized synchro to let loose. Film strength and lubricity are off the charts. Their engine oil 0-30 is basicly the same story. I picked up 2mpg over Mobile 1 in fuel economy, what does that say about lubricity. The chemist that designed it told me personally that you could run it 60000 miles. BUT, I change it every 5k...Im a picky SOB. Start using this stuff before 30k miles and they give you a 150k warranty(included) as well on any component serviced with a BG product. In my opinion BG products are the only professional grade chemistry available to the masses. CK it out at BGFINDASHOP.COM. And no, I dont work for BG, Im just a BG junky...Jim

Last edited by PASSIONRE; 06-18-2010 at 04:52 PM.
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post #13 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-18-2010, 06:43 PM
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I have had really good results with RP stuff and have tracked my non-convertible(no roll bar on the Sky) for well over 150K miles of street and track.

I am sure it explains the Sky's gas mileage now. I also drive it in the winter and GM gear boxes are always a little stiff on the first 1-2 shift in the morning.

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post #14 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-18-2010, 07:25 PM
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Just ordered Motul 75w90 GL4 or GL5 (can't remember). I just need to find a good info how to do it and I'm up to the job.
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post #15 of 30 (permalink) Old 06-18-2010, 07:51 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NormSky View Post
I have had really good results with RP stuff and have tracked my non-convertible(no roll bar on the Sky) for well over 150K miles of street and track.

I am sure it explains the Sky's gas mileage now. I also drive it in the winter and GM gear boxes are always a little stiff on the first 1-2 shift in the morning.
synchromax?

or

max gear?

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