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Discussion Starter #1
First of all. Have any of you guys noticed where they rear view mirror is for this car...take a look and u might find it interesting. and the nother things is, i dont know how the miata is gonna be able to beat this thing cause has better power/weight ration that the miata. if anyone knows the power/weight ratio for the miata let me know cause as fas as i can tell....the miata will not even touch this thing.:cool :cheers
 

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Discussion Starter #4
awww go ahead and ruin my fun. i was looking forward to where it was before on the concept.
 

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Concepts have to come back to reality to make it to production :smile
 

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I'd never seen that picture of the concept before. I like that idea of where the mirror is at. Hadn't noticed that before.
As for the Mazdaspeed Miata weight/hp ratio... let me see what I can dig up.

*EDIT*

From what I found the Mazdaspeed Miata will weigh around 2400lbs with 178hp/166lb-ft torque. The base Miata is sitting at 142/125. With the Solstice at 170/170 and 2800lbs. The base Miata doesn't really stand a chance but the Mazdaspeed... 400 pounds less and 8hp more :skep We will see.
 

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Otravez said:
[From what I found the Mazdaspeed Miata will weigh around 2400lbs with 178hp/166lb-ft torque. The base Miata is sitting at 142/125. With the Solstice at 170/170 and 2800lbs. The base Miata doesn't really stand a chance but the Mazdaspeed... 400 pounds less and 8hp more :skep We will see. [/B]
What's a Mazda Speed? Is that a version of Miata?
 

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Discussion Starter #10
your comparing the bas solstice to the top of the line miata...cant be done.. take the superchargerd version with 240/225 and compare that to the miata....see my point.:jester
 

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Darkhamr said:
Well looking at another article from C&D, they mention the prototype Solstice to have been rumored at 2860lbs and the production version coming in at 350lbs more! If that's the case (3200lbs) I may reconsider a Solstice purchase.

http://www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=29&article_id=7724
Ok... That is more than a 350z weighs. That number cannot be correct. Once you break the 3000 lbs barrier, is it still even considered a roadster? :rolleyes

Seeing as how the Z is still selling more than any other sports car - the solistice had better toss out some better numbers than that to tap into the Z's market - and even the miata's possibly. Even with its extremely low price. I would shoot for about 2700 lbs or less. Why could it not be done?

Maybe that electric hard top is throwing on the extra meat :D

-Whit
 

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Darkhamr said:
Well looking at another article from C&D, they mention the prototype Solstice to have been rumored at 2860lbs and the production version coming in at 350lbs more! If that's the case (3200lbs) I may reconsider a Solstice purchase.

http://www.caranddriver.com/article.asp?section_id=29&article_id=7724
The C&D figure is generally believed to be wrong (pure speculation on C&D's part or deliberate mis-information by Pontiac).
 

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mceb said:
The C&D figure is generally believed to be wrong (pure speculation on C&D's part or deliberate mis-information by Pontiac).
I have to believe it's wrong as well. Either that or gross incompetance on GM's enginnering dept.
 

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zcar222 said:
Ok... That is more than a 350z weighs. That number cannot be correct. Once you break the 3000 lbs barrier, is it still even considered a roadster? :rolleyes

Seeing as how the Z is still selling more than any other sports car - the solistice had better toss out some better numbers than that to tap into the Z's market - and even the miata's possibly. Even with its extremely low price. I would shoot for about 2700 lbs or less. Why could it not be done?

Maybe that electric hard top is throwing on the extra meat :D

-Whit
Might want to look over the thread entitled "Weight on Autoline Detroit"

http://www.solsticeforum.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&threadid=78&perpage=15&pagenumber=2

BTW the 350Z comes in around or over 3400lbs. And in summary, it looks like the 2860lbs curb is correct and appropriate.

The C&D is largely incorrect, GM's official info seems to be 2860 curb and "around" 50% distribution.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
See yeah I could see that 350Z coming at that weight but it puts out a lot of hP to boot, we all have to think power to weight. Hp is only as good as how fat the thing is its moving. lets say we got 240hp with 225 ft/lbs right, and the car wieghs lets just say 2800 lbs. youve got a ratio or 11.somethin to 1 so for every HP you got you have 11 pounds. think of go-karts the normally have 5HP lets just say on average plus the driver and kart its self and they move half decent....all I'm sayin is just think of power to weight thats all that matters really.:cheers
no matter what this car will be super fun to drive around just cause of how small it is plus rear wheel drive...man this car is going to rock.
 

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The mazda is about 17.2 lb/hp. The solstice is 16.8 at "advertised" specs.

And the 350Z works out to be 11.9.

Now the MazdaSpeed Miata, as measured by C&D weighs in at a hefty 2540lbs - and about 14 1/2 lb/hp.

If the Solstice *Charged (insert your favorite bent here, be it turbo- or super-) weighs in at an additional 40lbs (for argument's sake), at 2900lbs, then:

It only needs about 205 hp to get to the same lb/hp of the miata, and 245 hp to get to the same lb/hp of the 350Z. At the fantasy level of 300 hp, it approaches 9.6, which is tantalizingly close to the Corvette Convertible (9.1) but still not beating it.

Just had this info around since I was gathering it for my other weight chart.
 

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solsticeman said:
The mazda is about 17.2 lb/hp. The solstice is 16.8 at "advertised" specs.

And the 350Z works out to be 11.9.

Now the MazdaSpeed Miata, as measured by C&D weighs in at a hefty 2540lbs - and about 14 1/2 lb/hp.

If the Solstice *Charged (insert your favorite bent here, be it turbo- or super-) weighs in at an additional 40lbs (for argument's sake), at 2900lbs, then:

It only needs about 205 hp to get to the same lb/hp of the miata, and 245 hp to get to the same lb/hp of the 350Z. At the fantasy level of 300 hp, it approaches 9.6, which is tantalizingly close to the Corvette Convertible (9.1) but still not beating it.

Just had this info around since I was gathering it for my other weight chart.
so, what will it be with ~600hp? :D :wink
 

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Never have understood why people get so wound up about horsepower, really it just tells you what the top speed is liable to be, not how long it will take to get there.

Accelleration is a function of torque, gearing, and weight and then not what the peak torque is but what the curve looks like.

A car with a sudden torque peak at a high rpm will have impressive hp but without a CVT or driving an electric motor, will not be very useful.

A diesel-electric locomotive or a generating station is designed to run at peak efficiency at one specific rpm and everything is optomised for that. Passenger cars need to operate over a wide range of engine speeds and with the emphasis today on economy, the typical cruise rpm is at or below 2000 rpm to minimise pumping losses.

Now advances in computer controls and Variable Valve Timing (VVT - note this is not *duration* whiich is what you really need but *timing* - saw the first VVT design for a small block chevvy quite a long time ago - was a timing chain with a bar between the crank and cam gears having two small gears, one at each end. By sliding the bar to one side or the other, the cam timing could be advanced or retarded. Of course the controls and sensors required to be useful were not available then.

Just as a hysterical note, the concept of variable valve timing is truely ancient going back to at least the 1700s and the first steam engines. During the heyday of steam locomotives, the engineer used the "johnson bar" more than the throttle.

My point being that hp may help to sell cars (why untill about 1971, American engines were rates by gross rather than net hp and gasoline octane was quoted by the research method - the numbers were bigger) but it is the area under the torque curve that determines how fast it will accellerate.

Side note: in Europe things were different: manufacturers played games to keep the hp as low as possible since in many places in the early days taxes were based on hp. Later it became more common to tax on displacement since you could not play as many games with the cylinder size as ratings. That and high taxes on gasoline are why you find so many high powered/small displacement engines coming from overseas. The rules are different.
 
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