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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Exciting Day - Dealer confirmed Vin # finally available & Vom's showing car in transit. Yeah!! I joked with Dealer about North Carolina situation, Ebay, etc... & then Dealer says that he will stick to his prior agreements of Sticker price (+) $2,085.00. Excitement went down a bit & my questions started flowing!!

I asked, "What is this $2,085.00 your talking about - Dealer kindly explained that it includes the Exterior/Interior protections & warranties, and electronic disabling device, & an upgraded alarm system, which all cars at his dealership get when they are unloaded off the trucks.

I explained that I did not want any of his Dealer add ons & he said it wasn't an option as their Dealership policy is to only sell cars with the added $2,085.00 - yeah right!!!

So I agreed to review everything & further discuss on Monday as Dealer was leaving town for the weekend.

I promptly went to Dealership (knowing Dealer would be gone). I asked for copies of paperwork showing the dealer addons & costs for all cars on this lot. I was provided the following breakdown:

Exterior Protection/Interior Protection - $995.00
Guardian's Padlock state of the art electronic disabling device - $495.00
Chapman 400 E.V.S.S alarm system - $595.00

TOTAL VALUE = $3,085 with a package savings of <1,000> for a Special Package Price of $2,085.00.

I asked for the manager at the Dealership. I asked the manager to show me how the alarm system is installed & explained that I wanted to see every place on the car that will be altered by their installation (including all wiring, all drilling, all attachments, etc....) Manager explained that he didn't know. I explained that someone in the Dealership must know as every car on the lot gets this package - right??? Manager not too happy!!

So, I move on to the Exterior/Interior Protections - I asked manager what type of protect was put on the vehicle - manager didn't understand the question - I said, Is the protectant sprayed on the car, rubbed on the car, or what - manager said he didn't know. I questioned how every car on the lot could receive this treatment & he not know how it happens. Manager then calls Dealer (who is out for the weekend - this is the owner by the way) - Manager asked Dealer same questions - Dealer doesn't know the aswers but explained that I should return on Monday to further discuss - I agreed.

I then proceeded back to the parts & service department to inquire about the protection products. Parts couldn't help me & they told me they didn't have any of the product to sell me. Service manager told me he knew of the products but did not know how the products were applied to the car. Finally, we found 1 laborer who said he knew how the product was applied as he had done it once before. He explained that some spray materiel was sprayed onto the fabric & some silicone type material was rubbed onto the paint with a rag. No wiping, rinsing, buffing, spraying - just rub it on like wax & thats it!! I asked if I could see a sample of the products, but none were available at the Dealership - seems odd since every vehicle on the lot gets this treatment, but the did agree I could come back on Monday to get a sample.

I then got to talk to the laborer 1 on 1. He explained that he would give me a sample of the product on Monday if I wanted some. He had trouble understanding English but was very nice - I tried to explain that I wanted to buy a bottle of the product so that I could use it at home - He said he could give me some on Monday rather than me buying it!!! Nice Guy!!

So, the Dealer has committed to selling the car at sticker, but is now blackmailing me into add ons? Surely not!!!!!!! Can't be legal - rigt!!! I guess he should add aftermarker wheels for 20K too - anything to get me to back out of the deal so that he can get the car - right. Oh, is he going to wish he didn't F&$%%(^(^ with me when this is over!! He probably doesn't know that I am basically retired & have more time to make his life H#@%@ than he ever imagined - So, bring on the ideas, thoughts, angles, etc....I want to make him pay!!!

Not about money for me - Strickly principal!!

Does he really think I would allow him to drill holes into my baby to add aftermarket junk --I probably won't sleep!!

Thanks for your thoughts & suggestions!

USA
 

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Sounds Like Something I Stepped In Once.

What Area Are You In And Does Your State Have

Consumer Protection Laws To Keep The Dealer

From Padding Your Order.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I'm in Southern California (Ventura County) - I won't spend my time looking into whether or not its legal - I really don't care!

I am a diehard GM fan - have been buying GM forever!! Whether its legal or not, isn't my issue. I was told sticker when I bought the car & now I'm being told sticker (+) - simply not acceptable to me even if its legal - not good for Pontiac, not good for GM, not good for me!!

I assure you Dealer will be sorry before this is over, unless he politely changes his mind on Monday - I'll give him the weekend to make his final decisions!!!

Can anyone think of hoops to put the dealer through - how difficult can I make his job??????

USA
 

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I'd ask him where does he buy his pants? With balls that big I figure he must get them custom made. Wow! I had a Honda dealer try and pull the "Exterior Protectant" thing too. They said it protected against acid rain. I told them I never lost a car yet.
 

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did you have a signed sales contract showing the total price to include tax title and tags....just wondering???
 

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You got money, right? Say you'll agree to it, as long as he agrees to give you and your film crew "Full Access" during the entire process. Tell him you are making a documentary about Car Dealers who screw people as a way to make the money back that he screwed you out of.

Hire some Film School kids, make sure you have more than one camera. Have them interview other customers about their opinion to these tactics and get film of their purchases too. Have the guy "on tape" say why he is adding these charges to your car. If you got the time and you got the money, I can't think of a bigger way to be an a$$ than to stick a camera in someone's face.
 

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I know we talked bout this already but heres a thought....

Call GM and Soolstice HQ. Tell them what your dealer is doing, and on monday, take a witness.. See what the dealer says... and keep HQ informed. whether We(the forum) believes it or not GM IS VERY CONCERNED ABOUT THE LAUNCH OF THIS CAR!!! Let them know, ask your fellow forum members to let them know. Did you see how fast that car was pulled off of EBAY?

And for the rest of you, take a lesson from this.... Get a signed and clearly stated contract.....

Damned crumby dealers...... they are the sole reason people walk on my lot and expect me to lie to them!
 

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cadillacricket said:
I know we talked bout this already but heres a thought....

Call GM and Soolstice HQ. Tell them what your dealer is doing, and on monday, take a witness.. See what the dealer says... and keep HQ informed. whether We(the forum) believes it or not GM IS VERY CONCERNED ABOUT THE LAUNCH OF THIS CAR!!! Let them know, ask your fellow forum members to let them know. Did you see how fast that car was pulled off of EBAY?

And for the rest of you, take a lesson from this.... Get a signed and clearly stated contract.....

Damned crumby dealers...... they are the sole reason people walk on my lot and expect me to lie to them!
Oh sure, I guess you could do it that way too. ;)
 

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USA Millionaire said:
I won't spend my time looking into whether or not its legal - I really don't care!
But if it's not legal, your case suddenly gets much easier. A lot of places try to skirt the law with the average consumer, but once they realize they have a customer who knows the law and knows the regulatory agencies involved who can shut them down if they don't comply, they become much more cooperative. For instance, Best Buy used to be infamous for a practice known as "loading" (or something like that). Basically, it meant that they would give you a deal on a major electronics item if they knew you would buy lots of accessories and things like warranty plans, etc. But it was illegal (at least in this state). It didn't stop them from trying to scam you that way, but in reality, if you got them to give you a great deal by telling them to add on all sorts of extras, you could then tell them to put it all back and insist they give you the same deal on the main item. So few people knew the law that the employees would insist you're crazy until you got a manager and used some of the buzzwords that showed you understood your rights as a consumer. Anyway, it might be worth looking at the possibility, because if it really is illegal, your battle would be much simpler.

Also, another idea along the same lines as Stang mentioned would be to call a couple of local TV stations who have consumer help lines. They love to find things just like that where people are getting screwed by greedy businesses and add outrageous markups for silly things that you don't need. I've seen some of the local reporters really get in people's faces when they were ripping people off. It almost always resulted in the situation being corrected, even if it wasn't a technically illegal practice. The bad press just wasn't worth it.

Also, Cadillac's idea to let GM know is a great place to start. If anybody is in a position to lean on a dealer, they might be in the best position to do it. GM really seems to be trying to make everything about this a pleasurable experience for its first buyers. Good luck.
 

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Looks like Gov. Arnold has you back:



SACRAMENTO, Calif., July 26 -- The California Motor Car Dealers Association (CMCDA) announced that Governor Schwarzenegger signed AB 68 (Montanez) this afternoon.

The California Car Buyer's Bill of Rights is a compromise measure that was negotiated by key lawmakers and auto dealers, with input from consumer advocates. It is weaker than the initiative that was proposed, but represents a step forward for consumer protection in California. Key features in Assembly Bill 68, the California Car Buyer's Bill of Rights, authored by authored by Assemblywoman Cindy Montañez:


-- Prohibits a dealer from adding charges for after-market products or services, including such hugely profitable items as extended service contracts, anti-theft etching, and undercoating, after the dealer has negotiated the sale or lease of a car, unless the dealer first informs the buyer of the actual cost of purchasing or financing these add-on items and obtains the buyer’s consent.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Love the idea of student filming & certainly may go public if necessary, but I really don't want the media involved as I don't want Pontiac or GM to get bad press because of certain Dealerships. I care more about the company than I do about this or other bad Dealers.

I'll check the legality if he doesn't back off on Monday. Certainly simpler for me, but then nothing gets changed for the next customers who don't know the difference. I really don't like that. I want all customers loving Pontiac & GM, not later regretting the whole deal.

Maybe I'll just try to buy the entire place & hire some honest people to run the joint!!

No written contract, but I do have written quotes showing all estimated prices & nothing if remotely mentioning company policy to add 2,085.00 to all cars.

Keep the ideas flowing because I will use them!! :devil:

USA
 

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Dealer BS

Yeah we have a dealer around here that does that BS too, I asked a salesman to tell me the truth about it, he said the paint protectant was a coat of wax, the interior treatment was spray on scotch guard(which most cars come from the factory with) and armor all. I told him that i didn;t want that stuff, he said if you buy one here you will get it because that is the first theing they do when one comes in... then he said it was actually a way for them to give someone more money for their trade in... I said so if I traded my car in on this one I can just deduct the 800 dollars off my trade in value and that is what you gave me... he said basically yes... then I asked what about someone that has no trade in, he said well if they don't say anything we usually leave the charge on, and if they do we will take it off....
I think i would just ask them if they want to take that off the deal or be assure that they will lose more than 2800 dollars in future sales from all the bad things you will say about them when someone comes and asks about your car... and where you got it...and I Know a bunch of people will be asking you about your car and who you bought it from.....
 

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USA Millionaire said:
Exciting Day - Dealer confirmed Vin # finally available & Vom's showing car in transit. Yeah!! I joked with Dealer about North Carolina situation, Ebay, etc... & then Dealer says that he will stick to his prior agreements of Sticker price (+) $2,085.00. Excitement went down a bit & my questions started flowing!!

I asked, "What is this $2,085.00 your talking about - Dealer kindly explained that it includes the Exterior/Interior protections & warranties, and electronic disabling device, & an upgraded alarm system, which all cars at his dealership get when they are unloaded off the trucks.

I explained that I did not want any of his Dealer add ons & he said it wasn't an option as their Dealership policy is to only sell cars with the added $2,085.00 - yeah right!!!

So I agreed to review everything & further discuss on Monday as Dealer was leaving town for the weekend.

I promptly went to Dealership (knowing Dealer would be gone). I asked for copies of paperwork showing the dealer addons & costs for all cars on this lot. I was provided the following breakdown:

Exterior Protection/Interior Protection - $995.00
Guardian's Padlock state of the art electronic disabling device - $495.00
Chapman 400 E.V.S.S alarm system - $595.00

TOTAL VALUE = $3,085 with a package savings of <1,000> for a Special Package Price of $2,085.00.

I asked for the manager at the Dealership. I asked the manager to show me how the alarm system is installed & explained that I wanted to see every place on the car that will be altered by their installation (including all wiring, all drilling, all attachments, etc....) Manager explained that he didn't know. I explained that someone in the Dealership must know as every car on the lot gets this package - right??? Manager not too happy!!

So, I move on to the Exterior/Interior Protections - I asked manager what type of protect was put on the vehicle - manager didn't understand the question - I said, Is the protectant sprayed on the car, rubbed on the car, or what - manager said he didn't know. I questioned how every car on the lot could receive this treatment & he not know how it happens. Manager then calls Dealer (who is out for the weekend - this is the owner by the way) - Manager asked Dealer same questions - Dealer doesn't know the aswers but explained that I should return on Monday to further discuss - I agreed.

I then proceeded back to the parts & service department to inquire about the protection products. Parts couldn't help me & they told me they didn't have any of the product to sell me. Service manager told me he knew of the products but did not know how the products were applied to the car. Finally, we found 1 laborer who said he knew how the product was applied as he had done it once before. He explained that some spray materiel was sprayed onto the fabric & some silicone type material was rubbed onto the paint with a rag. No wiping, rinsing, buffing, spraying - just rub it on like wax & thats it!! I asked if I could see a sample of the products, but none were available at the Dealership - seems odd since every vehicle on the lot gets this treatment, but the did agree I could come back on Monday to get a sample.

I then got to talk to the laborer 1 on 1. He explained that he would give me a sample of the product on Monday if I wanted some. He had trouble understanding English but was very nice - I tried to explain that I wanted to buy a bottle of the product so that I could use it at home - He said he could give me some on Monday rather than me buying it!!! Nice Guy!!

So, the Dealer has committed to selling the car at sticker, but is now blackmailing me into add ons? Surely not!!!!!!! Can't be legal - rigt!!! I guess he should add aftermarker wheels for 20K too - anything to get me to back out of the deal so that he can get the car - right. Oh, is he going to wish he didn't F&$%%(^(^ with me when this is over!! He probably doesn't know that I am basically retired & have more time to make his life H#@%@ than he ever imagined - So, bring on the ideas, thoughts, angles, etc....I want to make him pay!!!

Not about money for me - Strickly principal!!

Does he really think I would allow him to drill holes into my baby to add aftermarket junk --I probably won't sleep!!

Thanks for your thoughts & suggestions!

USA
It's not legal here in ct. I know a dealler that was doing about the same thing, tell you that you have to have the extended service contracts, a few people went the lawyers and then the attny general looked into it. They ended up giving these people their cars for free. It was quite a few years ago but it was in all the local newspapers.

zero/zipper ct.
 

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Moving to the correct forum.

Your dealer wins the award for biggest a*****e of the year. I would call Solstice HQ, make is life miserable like you are asking to "see" everything, call your state consumer affairs office and would consider local media as he's clearly taking advantage of a new car launch (unless he does this all the time!).
 

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USA, just in jest here, please take it as that but maybe he figured out who you were from the forum and believed your 100k offer for #1 and assumed you were loaded like the rest of us> :lol:

Now for the serious, I like the idea of a couple of college students with video cameras and mics rolling tape as you walk in to finalize deal for later broadcast on F/x or the CNN as "Dealers Gone Wild."
 

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I hate to say "I told you so"

Remember last week when we were "ranting" over some guy selling a 1st 1k for a profit. I was summarily against it and others were too...but there were plenty who supported the guy saying it was "free-enterprise." I pointed out this EXACT scenario and warned you guys about "free-enterprise" and some dealers. This ought to be a wake up call to all of us to RE-verify our purchase contracts. This dealer was pretty shrewd...he pulled out the "all our cars get it line" and used it well. The alarm system is probably the old "keycard-type" that is totally worthless and costs around $20 bucks. The whole "protection kit" is probably costing the dealership around $75 or so. Hope things shape up for you USA and we'll keep our fingers crossed that you can get your car at the agreed upon price.
 

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achieftain said:
Now for the serious, I like the idea of a couple of college students with video cameras and mics rolling tape as you walk in to finalize deal for later broadcast on F/x or the CNN as "Dealers Gone Wild."
The dealership has the right and likely would kick these people off his lot. Dealerships are not public property. He could use the excuse of liability in having a bunch of armatures running all around his lot scratching up cars and annoying customers. .

The better idea would be the local TV crew from one of those consumer protection segments. Even if they get kicked off the lot, when they report the segment, they tell the public the dealer refused to comment as the General Manager is trying to cover the camera lens. This would have a far greater impact than some cheaply made documentary shown on local access that nobody would see.
 
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