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Discussion Starter #1
Ok,
So a while back, I installed a TiAL Q BOV. I moved the hose from the stock bov location, to the tial...and let her rip. When I bought the tial it came with a 11lb spring, which didn't allow the bov to open when I went wot and let off, so I'd get the compressor surge sound. It ran fine and didn't give me no real issue, just got the surge, and after a while got the cel. I moved the hose back to the stock bov, and ordered a 6lb spring from TiAL. When I got it, I did the spring swap on the bov, and cranked it up. It immediately felt odd. When I'd give it gas, and let off, it would definitely open and release the pressure, but soon after it felt like it wanted to die and stop...then sounded fine after it had its tantrum. I drove it around because I had people telling me that it was normal, and the car will get used to it and run fine after a few miles. So I drove it around, never got a cel, but I'd feel the car pull back when I'd give it gas and let off. The rpm's would drop then rise back up after a few seconds. I was told it shouldn't be doing it any damage, but shortly after, the car felt like it lost power. Still no cel, but I noticed I could NOT go wot if I tried. If you stepped on the gas, it just wouldn't go anywhere. The car would sound like it wanted to haul ass, but it would pick up extremely slow. So I moved the hose back to the stock bov, and it feels normal now, but now when I try and go wot, it'll only max out at 13psi, and after a second or two of holding it, it will bog down and the rpms will drop hard. Then it'll only give me 3lbs max on wot. After I turn it off, and turn it back on, I can see 13lbs again, but hit it wot again...and it'll bog down, and give a max psi of 3lbs on wot. It's really weird. I looked around for leaks with no luck :( HELPPPPPP. Sorry for the long story, but I just need all the help I can get. I want to mod but I def want to fix this first. Still no cel, and I have a trifecta 23lb tune, dejon intercooler, dejon intake, werks phenolic spacers, ddm I/c pipes, solo dual center exhaust, solo downpipe.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
It is back to stock. The hose is back on the stock location, and the car runs fine everyday. Only when I wot, it'll bog down..never reach anything above 13psi, and then only give me 3psi after that if I try to wot. I have to stop somewhere, stop and start the car, and I'll get more psi but I won't ever get anything above 13psi. My problem is that it has a 23lb tune. There should be no reason why the car bogs when I hold it at wot, slows me down, then only gives me 3psi after that. That's in the stock location, with the TiAL bov disconnected.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Another thing that I've noticed is that it spools really fast. Almost as if I had the "competition mode" on.
 

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Competition mode has no effect on the spool....

Also, the ECM is programmed for a recirculating overpressure release. Your TIAL iirc is releasing the pressure to atmosphere. a VERY different operation than your car expects. This is absurdly common in the cobalt community, and takes a good tuner to work out the issues. Even then it is never perfect with the factory ecm.

My recommendation, just sell the Tial and run a recirc system.

Why do you feel the need for an atmospheric bov?
 

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Discussion Starter #6
I don't feel the need for it, but I do like how they sound. Besides, I plan on getting a diff turbo in the near future. The Tial is no longer the issue, I have placed everything back to stock and I'm having this issue. Why would my car only give me 13lbs of boost (tuned for 23), then when I go wot..it bogs down and will only give me 3 lbs of boost after that if I go wot. Then once I turn the car off and back on, it'll give me 13lbs again? Did I blow a map sensor? If it was a boost leak, would it bog my car down and give me 3lbs until I turn it off? Has anyone ever had this problem??
 

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Discussion Starter #7
I could have sworn competition mode made the car spool faster? Allowing it to be more efficient for things like auto x and what not.
 

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Have you placed the hoses back to stock position, or removed the trial bov completely? Sorry, hard to read through the large blocks of text.

You likely have either a boost leak, or some kind of compromise in the recirc system.
 

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I don't feel the need for it, but I do like how they sound. Besides, I plan on getting a diff turbo in the near future. The Tial is no longer the issue, I have placed everything back to stock and I'm having this issue. Why would my car only give me 13lbs of boost (tuned for 23), then when I go wot..it bogs down and will only give me 3 lbs of boost after that if I go wot. Then once I turn the car off and back on, it'll give me 13lbs again? Did I blow a map sensor? If it was a boost leak, would it bog my car down and give me 3lbs until I turn it off? Has anyone ever had this problem??
Yes, if you have a leak or loose clamp somewhere it will go into reduced power mode and allow you to run only 3 lbs of boost afterwards. First step, check all of your intercooler clamps. If you still have the factory ones, replace them with t-clamps as soon as you can. Second, it sounds like you were running a BOV without blocking off the internal BOV on the turbo. If you are going to run an aftermarket BOV you MUST put a block off plate on your stock recirc valve. Compressor surge is no good. I don't know how long you drove your car allowing the turbo to spin backwards instead of vent, but it is definitely not good for it. Good news is that it is still wanting to boost for you and not making any odd noises, you are probably ok on that count. Third check your waste gate and your boost controller to make sure they are in their original positions. Super fast spooling sounds like you either adjusted the waste gate or switched the hoses on the boost controller. Finally, get someone to check for hidden or pending codes on your car. I guarantee you there are some there that just haven't popped a CEL.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
THANKS!!! I will do this.
WillBeck, No I have not removed the TiAL bov completely. The hose is back in the stock bov location.

I have all tbolt clamps except on the elbow going to the tb, but I feel I may have a leak somewhere so I will check everything. Yes, I ran the BOV without blocking the internal bov. I was told that it didn't need to be blocked off because there was no vacuum line going to it, so it wouldn't matter. But I will keep this in mind when I decide to give it another try soon.
Yea I didn't run the car too long with the compressor surge, it still spools and doesn't give me problems so I'm assuming it's ok. Boost controller? Where can I find this, and what should I look for? I didn't adjust the waste gate, but is the boost controller the "T" where the hoses are connected to (intake manifold/cold charge pipe/stock bov?) If so all I did was move the hose from the stock bov to the TiAL, then back to the stock one. Thanks for the help guys. This helps a ton.
 

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Ok one more thing for you to try then. Take that BOV off completely and try running With just the stock one on the car. There is a chance the BOV on but not hooked up (slight chance), be leaking when you get around 13 psi. I don't think that your issue before was the spring, I think your issue was not having a block off plate on the stock one. So your first issues were getting compressor surge because your Car was trying to vent in two places and not getting the air out quick enough in either spot. So then you switched to a lighter spring, but were still having issues and went back to the stock BOV. Well with that lighter spring it may be leaking around 13 psi. When your car detects an air leak it will put you into reduced power mode (which will only let you run a few pounds of boost) until you restart the car. Most of the time you won't throw a CEL, but there will be a pending code. Soooo, long story short, try taking the Tial off and running a stock tube on that side and see if it fixes your problem.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Actually what happened was when I first installed the TiAL, I did have a Turbo Tech block off plate on the stock bov. Ran it and it ran fine, full 23lbs of boost, only thing is that the spring was too stiff and didn't let the TiAL open up...causing the compressor surge.
When I moved the hose back to the stock location, I removed the block off plate, and then lost it. When I told a friend I lost it but wanted to try the new softer spring, he told me it wouldn't need the block off plate since it's the vacuum hose that pulls the bov, without the hose the stock bov won't open and release the pressure. So that's why I went ahead and tried the softer spring with the stock bov cover still attached, no block off plate. Should I get a diff spring? Is the 6lb spring too soft? I was just going by the hg chart on the TiAL website, and I believe I read our hg is about 11 at idle?
 

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With our cars at 20 inches of mercury at idle the 11 lb spring looks like it should be the one. I'm not sure why it wouldn't work for you. I know this sounds silly, but are you sure you had the right hose hooked to it?
 

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When I told a friend I lost it but wanted to try the new softer spring, he told me it wouldn't need the block off plate since it's the vacuum hose that pulls the bov, without the hose the stock bov won't open and release the pressure. So that's why I went ahead and tried the softer spring with the stock bov cover still attached, no block off plate
Sometimes friends don't know what they're talking about, the pressure inside the pipes will open the bov. The vacuum line applies pressure under boost to the bov to keep it closed and vacuum under deceleration to open it. You need a block off plate for the stock bov period, and if you're running the stock bov with the tial disconnected you have the same problem, except you can't use a block off plate on the tial you need to disconnect the bov and seal up the hole.
 

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If you are looking for the noise, put it back to stock and install a cold air intake. They do nothing for power but do make the sounds you are seeking.

The intakes on our cars are notoriously finicky. Even tiny changes in the air flow can cause big problems. But I agree, it looks more like your experimentation has caused a boost leak somewhere that is creating lingering problems.

Start with the basics, go back to stock, install T clamps everywhere and see if you can get back to your initial conditions and performance. Once you have that then change one thing at a time to see what changes result
 

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THANKS!!! I will do this.
WillBeck, No I have not removed the TiAL bov completely. The hose is back in the stock bov location.

Yes, I ran the BOV without blocking the internal bov.
Either go back to stock completely, or at least block off the internal waste gate. I guarantee blocking it will help, and stock will bring it back to perfect.

My stock LNF, with just gmpp intake makes all kinds of noise, I can't imagine how much more you would need.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Thanks bud. I appreciate the help.

I plan on getting another turbo, gotta go aftermarket bov soon anyways.
 

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Another thing that I've noticed is that it spools really fast. Almost as if I had the "competition mode" on.
sCompetition mode is just for traction control and skid control. If memory servce me correctly, all comp mode does is basically turns off traction control on our cars....until you start to get sideways, then it kicks traction control back on. Now on Cadillacs, it is a true competition mode. On Caddies, it will do all it can to keep the rear end sideways! It's awesome on the Caddies!
 

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Comp mode disables TC completely, but leaves ESC engauged, at about 60%-70% of normal. Therefore you can get sideways to a point, and then ESC will kick in and brake one wheel to straighten you out. The really neat part is that you can keep your foot in the throttle and still come out of the slide in full boost. Since TC is disabled, it creates the allusion that the turbo is spooling quicker, when actually you are just not having throttle taken away.

If you want to go completely Commando, then press an hold the TC button for about 8-10 seconds, it will cycle through the modes, until it shuts everything off except ABS. ABS can not be disabled.
 

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Sometimes friends don't know what they're talking about, the pressure inside the pipes will open the bov. The vacuum line applies pressure under boost to the bov to keep it closed and vacuum under deceleration to open it. You need a block off plate for the stock bov period, and if you're running the stock bov with the tial disconnected you have the same problem, except you can't use a block off plate on the tial you need to disconnect the bov and seal up the hole.
Shabby--- hate to bum you out (seeing as you think you know whats going on), but-- I can tell you FOR A FACT- I NEVER RAN A BLOCK OFF PLATE ON MY STOCK TURBO WITH A VENT TO ATMOSPHERE SETUP, and NEVER ENCOUNTERED STUTTERING, STALLING, or COMPRESSOR SURGE (HKS SSQV). The vacuum is necessary on the vent to atmosphere set up (at least in my application with the HKS SSQV) because the vacuum pressure pulls the diaphram up along with the pressure pushing the piston up in order for the pressure to be released to atmosphere.
 
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