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Anyway to disable or bypass airbag sensor in passenger seat.

54K views 162 replies 22 participants last post by  billdaman 
#1 ·
The seat passenger sensor stopped working. 3rd time. Is there a way to bypass the sensor and just leave the airbag on.

Thanks
 
#89 ·
There are photos on the forum, but the reinforcement is simply fabric tape that is applied on top of the outer mat (black) fabric. Not directly to the mylar.

Congratulations on the effort!

What interests me in particular, is this part:

It seems (as per @JohnWR ) it's not serviceable. Isn't there a traditional phenolite PCB inside this box where the Mylar tracks from the mat are connected to?
JR is correct. There is a PCB inside that box, but it is fully encapsulated (potted) with a white resin. No way to remove that resin to get to the tracks without further destroying the board+components. See the first pic here: Passenger Airbag Sensor
 
#94 · (Edited)
Now the next steps:
  • completing the reinforcement
  • unfortunately my scanner does not calibrate the PPS, and this will have to be done.
The system will still see the PPS module as problematic. The error will not go away by itself .... Hello Tech2 :cool:

And yet - we will record the exchange package from SDM to PPS. And sending the data back.
This will explain a lot and will allow you to create NOT an EMULATOR, but a correct working device while maintaining all the functionality (like the original PPS + switch + dimmer of the ON-OFF indicator light).
 
#95 ·
Now the next steps:
  • completing the reinforcement
  • unfortunately my scanner does not calibrate the PPS, and this will have to be done.
The system will still see the PPS module as problematic. The error will not go away by itself .... Hello Tech2 :cool:
Are you certain that it is a calibration problem? You may still have a break in the circuit. When i was experimenting with the PPS to decode the communication I switched among good, bad, and no sensor, and the fault always cleared itself when the good sensor was connected. My experience is obviously not exhaustive, but it seemed that once a sensor was calibrated there was no requirement to do it again.
 
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#98 ·
I have a hacked version of the maintenance manual - not very convenient to use ...:confused:
Here's an excerpt:
....Procedure
1. Re-zero the inflatable restraint passenger presence system whenever the seat
cushion or any component of the passenger presence system is removed.
Refer to Control Module References.
2. Program the inflatable restraint passenger presence system after
replacement. Refer to Control Module References.....

Perhaps I do not understand everything correctly?
 
#99 ·
I believe that part of the caliration procedure is intended to ensure that the sensor properly detects a occupant (or doesn't), since detection of an occupant requires that there be certain loads in certain areas. I think that this why the calibration is specified when the seat cushion is removed, but in my limited experience, no fault is generated.

The only time I have seen the calibration result in a fault is when an unused and never-calibrated sensor was connected. Sensors that have been moved even from one car to another have connected without a fault, but of course it is possible that there may be an error in occupant detection under some circumstances. By all appearances, transplanted sensors work just as well after transplant as they did before.

This sensor was one of the first "intelligent" seat sensors, designed to disable the airbag when a child or a child seat was in the passenger seat. In addition to the first-generation problems, there is also first-generation overkill in the procedures.
 
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#101 ·
I have not had to reset anything when switching from bad sensor to good sensor, or even when my emulator sends bad data to the SDM. Every time, I have cycled power to the car and, if the sensor is good this time, the fault clears by itself. That doesn't mean that it will in all cases, just that it always has for me.
 
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#106 ·
ADDITION:
Connected the restored PPS - the error is still present. It cannot be removed without using Tech2.
Today we checked whether the exchange of data between the SDM and the restored PPS will work - everything is fine, the information goes through.
For the experiment, we connected the SDM from the donor's car (the number is the same as that of my module - 15774620).
We recorded all the variants of the transmitted data.
Now my friend "sorcerer" is working with this information ....
 
#108 ·
Perhaps these are my assumptions, but ...
My PPS module "remembered" that it cannot work normally (there is an open circuit) and now it needs to be restarted. "...Re-zero..." according to GM.
In any case, I will try to do it on the service using Tech2.
 
#109 ·
Perhaps these are my assumptions, but ...
My PPS module "remembered" that it cannot work normally (there is an open circuit) and now it needs to be restarted. "...Re-zero..." according to GM.
In any case, I will try to do it on the service using Tech2.
That is a possibilty that i did not consider. Another possibility is that the repair has changed the resistance or capacitance of the circuit enough that the original calibration is no longer valid.

On the positive side, the solution to either possibity is the same.
 
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#111 ·
And here is a complete description of the verification procedure)))

Passenger Presence System Displaying Code Procedure

Description


When the ignition is turned ON, the inflatable restraint sensing and diagnostic module (SDM) will establish communication with the passenger presence system (PPS). When communication is established, the SDM will first request traceability/verification information from the PPS. If the SDM confirms that the correct PPS is in the vehicle, then the SDM will request the PPS status Data. If the PPS detects a malfunction, the PPS will set a DTC, and communicate with the SDM that a malfunction has occurred. The SDM will respond by disabling the instrument panel (I/P) module deployment loop, and then sets DTC B0081 while commanding the AIR BAG indicator ON to notify the driver of a PPS malfunction. The DTCs that the PPS set are non GMLAN and have to be retrieved through the SDM. The procedures below are designed to assist in the retrieval of these codes. Before you start, read these procedures carefully and completely. For further information regarding the PPS refer to SIR System Description and Operation.

PPS Displaying Code Procedure

Important: When the sensing and diagnostic module (SDM) starts to communicate with the PPS, the instrument panel cluster (IPC) and dash lights will begin dimming on and off. This is normal operation during this procedure and does not indicate additional system faults.



  1. Empty the front outboard passenger seat.
  2. Install a scan tool.
  3. Turn ON the ignition, with the engine OFF, and wait for the PPS to complete its bulb check function.
  4. With the scan tool, request the passenger presence system (PPS) DTCs. The scan tool will command the SDM to send a message to the PPS, which will initiate the DTC retrieval process. (This process will take about 13 seconds ).
  5. When the PPS receives a request for DTCs, the PPS will illuminate both PASSENGER AIR BAG ON and OFF indicators located on the IPC for 3 seconds . If the PPS does not turn ON both indicators within 20 seconds of the request for PPS DTCs, then repeat step 4.
  6. After the passenger AIR BAG ON and OFF indicators have illuminated for 3 seconds , cycle the ignition OFF for 3 seconds then turn the ignition back ON.
  7. After the PPS receives this request for data from the SDM, it will transmit the DTC data through the SDM to the scan tool. This data is only accessible for one ignition cycle, do not turn OFF the ignition while displaying PPS DTCs.
  8. The scan tool will then show any current or history DTCs. Refer to the Diagnostic Trouble Code (DTC) List - Vehicle to diagnose the DTC you have obtained. See: A L L Diagnostic Trouble Codes ( DTC )\Testing and Inspection\Diagnostic Trouble Code Descriptions
 
#112 · (Edited)
I continue to report....
The day before yesterday I was at the service station.
We carried out all actions according to the procedure prescribed by the GM.
Now I can say with confidence - after the mat loop is broken, the microprocessor of the PPS module remembers this event. Because the manufacturer does not give (and does not even assume) the possibility of repairing the mat - it is impossible to erase the fault in the module's memory using Teсh2 .
In the photo - errors in the "memory" of the PPS module.
 

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#113 · (Edited)
Device recovery is possible if two conditions are met simultaneously:
  • eliminate the break on the mat;
  • erase the memory of the cliff.

They talked a lot at the forum - after installation, the PPS board is filled with a nasty white compound.
We heated it with a hairdryer to 350 degrees Celsius - it only slightly changes color, but does not change its density.
We managed to get very neatly to the contacts of the mat on the board. We will now record the polling data for each track of the mat when power is applied to it. The processor model could also be read.
To continue work on the creation of a device that will actually replace and will perform all the functions of a regular PPS module, I bought a new module. Soon he will fly out to us. Let's write down the data of his exchange and move on!;)
 
#115 ·
We managed to get very neatly to the contacts of the mat on the board.
PERFECT! Given that I am not bound by legal obligation to keep the airbag system original,reaching the mat contacts to the board and applying a resistance value for "Passenger Present/ON" and another for "Pannsegner Absent/Child present/OFF" is my planned course of action. I have already sourced a GM(Opel) Airbag ON/OFF switch for that.
@E.G.P. , would you be so kind as to report the resistance values found in your new PPS for both conditions? Thanks

EDIT - BY THE WAY. You, sir, are a gentleman and scholar. 👏🍻
 
#114 ·
The things that manufacturers have done to make life hard to get a working airbag system (or other things) never ceases to amaze me. I guess part of it's the pretty antiquated "computer" systems they've designed. Clearly the auto industry was, and probably still is, extremely far behind the curve compared to where iPhones and desktop computers are. Clunky scan tools, ancient software, inscrutable codes. Best of luck EGP! I hope you can find something useful.
 
#116 ·
The things that manufacturers have done to make life hard to get a working airbag system
This is not only manufacturers' fault. It's also fault of a state of affairs where we citizens are patronized by the state, governments and policies that take the average individual for a stupid person. The resul being that the average citizen is becoming used to being raised and supported as such, and at the end is on the path to become the very stereotype that policies are based upon.
 
#125 ·
@agent008 I will definitely share information! The good news is that the exchange protocol is very slow. We will be able to record the exchange of SDM and the working module of the PPS. Everything further is solvable! I am waiting for a parcel with a new module. Already flies over the ocean ...
 
#132 ·
Sorry - did not report right away.
The day before yesterday I was at the service station. The new PPS is activated and everything works fine.
When the PPS was activated, we again recorded the data exchange.
My friend is working on decrypting the data packet and creating a 100% adequate working device.
This device will be able to replace (not emulate) the "native" modules. These modules are new PPS modules were produced in 2017 for a revocable campaign (see sticker on the box). Soon they will run out and it will be impossible to buy ...
 
#135 ·
Excellent. Since where I live doesn't demand a certified PPS, I would be a customer. Buying from you would mean more genuine PPS's would be left for those who actually have no option.
BUT, I still maintain my humble opinion about the most future-proof option being the on/off switch. If you'd be willing to share your research such that it could help others to make their own, on-off switchable module, it would be the ultimate solution for me.
If there's anything I can do to help please let me know. Thanks!
 
#137 ·
wow thats a lot of reading.... my "gm fix" just let go a few days ago.I hope you guys get this sorted out..I would possiably buy a new china unit if it didnt have to go to the dealer to be programed or whatever it needs. a good reliable system is what is needed, switchable would be my choice.I do like the dic idea. keep up the great work guys!!!
 
#138 ·
Time passes, but we are moving slowly. But ... let's move forward! :)
We recorded the exchange of data between SDM and PPS, but it was not possible to decode them in the desired form. The manufacturer insures itself reliably!
There is an idea - we will remove information directly from the SDM board, and not on the connectors. There are necessary points there right on the board ...
 
#149 ·
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#152 · (Edited)
Actually I have some experience with this from the Automotive Industry. Laminated windshields are required by NHTSA/DOT to have what is called a “Fragmentation” test done on every shifts production (Up to 500 pc.) A sample windshield is chosen at random. There is a 6 X 6” square cut from its center.

The glass sample is mounted onto a fixture and A 3” dia steel ball is loaded onto a chute that is about 15’ in the air. The ball is released and drops dead center onto the laminated sample. The amount and size of “Frag” on top of the specimen is analyzed and weighed.

Cant remember the exact specifications, but the idea is that only a minimal amount and frag size glass dust is allowed to separate from the laminated sample. Fail this test and the windshield ENTIRE RUN must be scrapped (and laminated glass cannot be recycled and is put in landfills..). Very expensive failure.

This test drives the highest level of process control in the laminate material (DuPont), furnace time, temperature and autoclave processing due to the extremely cost of a single frag test failure.

The integrity requirements of this test is why I choose to reject buying a GM vehicle with any possibility of chinese mainland produced junk glass (and I can tell with 100% certainty). Not too many years ago they were found to have falsified these frag tests and got caught red handed when the shi7 they shipped in was random tested in dock audits.

Heres how to tell if a vehicle has one of these chinese junk windshields in it. APTECH glass made in Ohio is the best automobile glass BTW, and OEM’s pay a stiff premium for the windshields AP makes that have world class levels of edge, glass and vinyl distortion.

 
#155 ·
OK, this thread is old, but the last post was less than a day ago. So I am going to ask.
1) are there any results yet?
2) John, you said you had a AIRBAG360.COM device in your glove compartment for the day it fails. Mine has not yet failed and of course when it does I will go for the RECALL but I need to get that substitute devise before it dissapears from the market. Is it still sold.
 
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#156 ·
OK, this thread is old, but the last post was less than a day ago. So I am going to ask.
1) are there any results yet?
2) John, you said you had a AIRBAG360.COM device in your glove compartment for the day it fails. Mine has not yet failed and of course when it does I will go for the RECALL but I need to get that substitute devise before it dissapears from the market. Is it still sold.
Status of my device is unchanged. I still can't get the last 15% reliability that I need to be comfortable with it.

I do not have an Airbag360 in my glove compartment. I do have one in my shop because even though it doesn't work, I am not ready to throw it away yet. As far as I know, no Airbag360 device has ever worked in a Kappa.
 
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