[Bagpypr]

Hi everyone, I am hoping someone can help me understand what is going on in my engine. I have read most of the threads I could find.

I have 07' GXP, I started noticing oil loss first off. Then I noticed occasional white and black exhaust. Sometimes in succession. Now I am getting a thin film of oil on the inside of the hood directly above the oil fill cap. It's not much, and it appears to be coming from the oil cap. I have also noticed a decent amount of oil in the charge tubes (enough to run when tipped). Cleaned twice and keeps returning.

I am assuming I have some sort of back pressure that is forcing oil out the oil fill cap.

After reading forum articles, I noticed the check valve that runs from mid engine to the MAF is clogged and I intend to clean that first. I have also ordered a PCV valve and intend on taking the intake manifold apart to inspect/clean or replace the PCV valve.

Maybe its the seal on the turbo?

My next step if all of the previous is unsuccessful, is to use a leakdown tester to see at what psi the piston rings allow air to flow past.

I hope it is not the latter as the fix will be intense work :brentil:

Any other thoughts? Suggestions?

Nationals is right around the corner and I won't take the car on a long road trip with it acting up this way.

 

[TomatoSoup]

Oil around the filler cap would suggest a bad seal there and that you should replace the cap.

That much oil in the intake pipes is very bad. Could just be the check valve is gummed-up, but with that much oil I'd start looking at the turbo seals.

 

[Bagpypr]

TS thanks, I hope you are right. That is a fairly easy fix compared to rings. Anything else come to mind as a possible problem?

Ugh, I'm not looking forward to this. Wish I'd have discovered the issue last fall and had all winter to fix... I should be driving

 

[rob the elder]

Based on the threads I have seen, most of the symptoms could be failure of the vents. I have seen oil in the charge tubes before because of the PCV valve failure.

I would get a new oil cap, replace the PCV and test it.

 

[TomatoSoup]

TS thanks, I hope you are right. That is a fairly easy fix compared to rings. Anything else come to mind as a possible problem?

Ugh, I'm not looking forward to this. Wish I'd have discovered the issue last fall and had all winter to fix... I should be driving

With the oil being in the intake pipes, highly unlikely it's your rings. Bad rings would let oil get into the combustion camber, and so more likely out to the exhaust.

I would get a new oil cap, replace the PCV and test it.

Correction, it's NOT the PCV (which is in the block and much harder to replace), just the vent check-valve.

 

[rob the elder]

Thanks

Just as an interesting side note, this venting is a classic problem with Harleys. The heads on Sportsters are vented by the down stroke of each piston as it forces air up through ports into the area above the valves. There are a pair of tubes that come off the valve cover area, one for each cylinder, that go into the air cleaner. The oil is controlled by flapper valves and a serpentine path to the vent holes in the heads. Over time, the flapper valves fail, then the heads start pumping oil into the aircleaner.

The fix is to replace the flapper valves with new, or what a lot of people do is buy an aftermarket external flapper valve. They are very robust, relatively small, will fit on standard flex tubing and last forever.

Here is one example

Harley Parts | Aftermarket Harley Davidson Motorcycle and Custom Parts and Accessories | Debrix Cycles - www.debrix.com

 

[R&T]

How many miles are on the turbo? That is the last place I would check.

I agree with what was said above and start there. Much easier and cost effective than the turbo.

 

[Bagpypr]

just turned 40k.

 

[Bagpypr]

I'm going to clean the check valve tonight, take car for a drive. Then this weekend, I'll pull the PCV and clean or replace it as needed. Baby steps

 

[rob the elder]

Sounds like a good plan.

 

[llllfly]

Would it be time for the OCC?
LLLFLY

 

[R&T]

At 40k I highly doubt it is the turbo. Sounds like you are starting in the right place with your plan.

 

[Bagpypr]

Thanks everyone.

Already a day behind schedule. I can't remove the f'ing check valve without a special tool. Hope the dealership carries one.

 

[GS Stage 1]

The tool is just a fuel line tool. You can pick up one of the multi sized tools for less than 10 bucks at any parts store.

 

[TomatoSoup]

Yep - one of these (you need the 3/8" size):

 

[MidniteBlues]

With the oil being in the intake pipes, highly unlikely it's your rings. Bad rings would let oil get into the combustion camber, and so more likely out to the exhaust.

Correction, it's NOT the PCV (which is in the block and much harder to replace), just the vent check-valve.

I'm going to clean the check valve tonight, take car for a drive. Then this weekend, I'll pull the PCV and clean or replace it as needed. Baby steps

Heads UP, TS said NOT the PCV valve, BUT instead the Vent Check Valve, much easier fix I'm told..:yesnod:

 

[Bagpypr]

Check valve is fine and working okay after being cleaned.

Where is the PCV located???

 

[GS Stage 1]

The PCV valve is under the intake manifold, which must be removed to access. It is my understanding that on our cars the PCV routes fumes into the intake, so if it had failed you would be experiencing excessive oil burning. The engine venting system works via the two braided steel lines from the head. The check valve line lets air into the engine and the other line lets air back out (there are internal baffles in the head that collect and condense oil vapors so that oil should not make its way back out). Here is a link to a thread that TS put together on this subject about a year ago: http://www.solsticeforum.com/forum/f63/why-where-you-should-shouldnt-run-oil-catch-can-occ-lnf-kappa-71640/ Read through the whole thread.

 

[Bagpypr]

Update - last night OutToLaunch (Tom Ogle) and I tore into the engine. I pulled off the charge tubes both are bone dry now and I am not sure why the oil is not leaking now. Maybe something came unclogged?

Pulled off about 90% of the intake manifold including all the things attached on and around it (pain in the butt). We could pull the intake manifold away from the block almost to the point that it would clear two of the studs, but it would snag on a bracket near the firewall (near the fuel pump I think). Anyway, we could not see how to go any farther without pulling off this fuel pump and the bracket so we stopped and put it back together with no extra parts

Took car for a drive and only problem is oil smoke out the exhaust. One problem fixed, one to go.

I will put a few miles on it and see if possibly the problem is fixed and just clearing excess oil in the system. However, if it does not stop, I think it'll will get a visit to my mechanic.

Any one have pictures showing this PCV valve. We stopped because we were pretty deep into it and still had no idea where to find the part. I do have a replacement, so I know what it looks like, just did not feel comfortable with my exploratory surgery without a better idea of where I was looking.

 

[Bagpypr]

Would it be time for the OCC?
LLLFLY

Not sure what LLLFLY is?


I have the Oil Catch can, and it was installed after all the problems started, maybe that is why no oil in charge tubes now?

I also have a GMR Stage 2 tune, but again, these problems were present before I put on the stage 2. I figure the new tune may have made the oil problem worse, but they did not cause the issues.