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Discussion Starter #1
Hey Guys and Gals,

I know that this issue must have been discussed numerous times on the board but I did a search found only a few threads with very little information.

I know what drifting is and have watched the races on TV and such. But I'm a little confused on a few aspects. I'm always hearing that you reef on the E-Brake to break traction and start the drift but I always thought the e-brake only locked a single rear tire on the car, wouldn't this throw you in 1 direction. In our Dune Buggies we had 'cutter brakes' that we could lock each rear wheel indepently to make sharp turns in the sand on the trails, do drift cars have these installed?

Also, I've heard that some people are able to drift in the Solstice others not. Personally, other than wet pavement even with the all weather tires my car acts like it glued to the pavement. I can burn them in first but other than that even in corners it is very solid.

I'm not saying I want to go crazy with drifting or anything but this is my first sports car and we do have some safe areas to play in and I would love to expand my driving skills.

Any thoughts, tips, tricks, advice, or as I said I know it is on the forum elsewhere a link to othe discussions that I couldn't find?

Thanks!
 

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Haven't seen an emergency brake yet that doesn,t activate both rear wheels
 

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Drifting just means you're driving the car in a four-wheel drift. The Solstice has a slight understeer, so when you are cornering hard, the front wheels don't quite pull you around, but if you put enough power to the rear, and you have the limited-slip rear end, you create a power oversteer, so the car just pushes to the outside of the curve. Add a little more power and you can hang the rear out a little and push yourself back in. That's drifting. You go around the curve sideways.

You've probably experienced something similar in your dune buggies, but if they're rear-engine buggies, they probably oversteer, so only the rear wheels drift and you keep the front wheels turned to the opposite of the the side you're turning.
 

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buggsy63 said:
Haven't seen an emergency brake yet that doesn,t activate both rear wheels
In theory they do, but one side usually grips better than the other, and the differential allows the other wheel to spin unless it's limited slip.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Ok, thanks information on the E-Brake makes a lot more sense!

As far as limited slip diff, is that fairly close to a locker (from my 4 Wheeling experince)? I am assuming that you do not a full locking diff but the limited slip gets you very close?
 

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I find the car pretty tough to get sideways by just rolling on power, especially on dry pavement. I usually have to give it a pretty aggressive clutch drop to get the back end coming out.
 

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DugsGMs said:
I find the car pretty tough to get sideways by just rolling on power, especially on dry pavement. I usually have to give it a pretty aggressive clutch drop to get the back end coming out.
I haven't tried doing donuts on dry pavement yet, but that's really drifting in a small circle.
 

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MisterE said:
Ok, thanks information on the E-Brake makes a lot more sense!

As far as limited slip diff, is that fairly close to a locker (from my 4 Wheeling experince)? I am assuming that you do not a full locking diff but the limited slip gets you very close?
Your dune buggy would have had twin handles setup to engage each rear brake individually for straight ahead traction. Having true differential action, the VW I assume, based unit, although utilizing swing axles emanating from the tranny still did what every regular diff does - it transmits power to the wheel with teh least traction. Fact of life. Now, by applying braking to the slipping, powered wheel you can shift power to the non-slipping wheel and therefore keep traction. Sme modern active traction assist controls on fwd cars do the same thing by sensing slip and applying the rakes to that wheel ever so slightly you prolly don't notice.

The LSD on the Sol, is as the name says, limited. If you don't feel the rearend fighting yo in slow parking maneuvers it is an indication that it is more limited than what was found on full-sized Pontiac posi-trac in the '70s.

Two or three places to see drifting used not related to streets of Tokyo or the sanctioned drifting competitions (in which Rhys Millen drives) are as follows
*Sprint cars - these holdovers from the '50s, with their roof mounted wings race in drift mode at speed- they get the drift, hang the car out and mash the pedal to the floor.
*Circuit Dirt Track - here I mean the short ovals that almost everyone has within an hours drive. This is stock car racing in the tradition of the sands of Daytona and cars that at one time were on the road. Fastest cars through a corner are the ones that are running at a big angle to the course and sliding through -i.e. drifting
*The new movie CARS - THE Hudson Hornet, winner of back to back to back stock car championships in the '50s (based on the real life adventures of former 'shine runners - would I make this up?), teaches the rookie Lightning McQueen how to "turn right to go left", and as he drifts through the infield in complete control after being shunted off the track. And of course he goes on to- just go see it and enjoy it on about 10 different levels.
 

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AustinTashis said:
I haven't tried doing donuts on dry pavement yet, but that's really drifting in a small circle.
No,that's just leaving a mark on where you have been - like a little dog peeing as high up on a tree to make other dogs think he's really much bigger. :glol:

The intent of drifting is still to get from point A to point B. Tony Stewart may do a donut or two tomorrow afternoon, but it'll be after 500 miles of "turn left go fast".
 

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achieftain said:
No,that's just leaving a mark on where you have been - like a little dog peeing as high up on a tree to make other dogs think he's really much bigger. :glol:

The intent of drifting is still to get from point A to point B. Tony Stewart may do a donut or two tomorrow afternoon, but it'll be after 500 miles of "turn left go fast".
It's still a good way to get used to what it feels like to break traction without losing control. A lot of people have this natural inclination to freak out when their their car gets loose. I mean, we're living in a culture of ABS and airbags. People are just sort of conditioned to sit tight and wait for the impact if they lose control of their cars. Doing donuts in a parking lot is one way to get used to the idea that you haven't really lost control just because you're sliding, and even when you lose control there are ways to regain it before you hit something.
 

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achieftain said:
*Sprint cars - these holdovers from the '50s, with their roof mounted wings race in drift mode at speed- they get the drift, hang the car out and mash the pedal to the floor.
There's more to it than that. It takes a lot of finesse. If you just stand on the pedal the rear end comes right around and you usually hit the wall going backwards.
 

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Yeah, a Solstice is a convertible and what could be more fun than a sunny day but I really have a blast in the rain. It's like "Alakazam.... You've now got twice the horsepower!" Find a flooded concrete parking lot and practice doing what every driving instructor will tell you not to do, Be so aggressive with throttle, steering and brakes that you loose traction (but just to the rear wheels). The hardest part is turning off what has become second nature in all your years of street driving. For me, it was mentally delaying the response to correct for a rear slide when it first starts or, in other words, holding the wheel just a little longer when the back end starts to come around. Yes, donuts are a part of that just as E-brake slides are a part. And its all fun!

Drifting is about looks and style. It's not just about going fast. You can watch a race around a road coarse or you can watch a drift competition around the same course. But only one of those will receive "Style Points." I like them both. It takes far better reflexes than I ever had to hang the back end of a car that far out, that often and make it look easy. And, regardless of what it is, an expert can make the near impossible look easy!:cool:
 

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Discussion Starter #14
achieftain said:
Your dune buggy would have had twin handles setup to engage each rear brake individually for straight ahead traction. Having true differential action, the VW I assume, based unit, although utilizing swing axles emanating from the tranny still did what every regular diff does - it transmits power to the wheel with teh least traction. Fact of life. Now, by applying braking to the slipping, powered wheel you can shift power to the non-slipping wheel and therefore keep traction. Sme modern active traction assist controls on fwd cars do the same thing by sensing slip and applying the rakes to that wheel ever so slightly you prolly don't notice.

The LSD on the Sol, is as the name says, limited. If you don't feel the rearend fighting yo in slow parking maneuvers it is an indication that it is more limited than what was found on full-sized Pontiac posi-trac in the '70s.

Close, one handle with up down action for left / right tire, we run IRS trans out of VW BUS to handle the power of beefed up engines, but yes no locker or limited slip in them. Yeah in four wheeling even with lockers in the rear we use the breaks to keep the front from slipping so traction gets applied more universally so the tires don't break traction. (No fancy traction control).

Cool your information make tons of sense and helps a lot, and yes I am used to the Safe-T-Trac and Posi-Trac from the 60's and 70's when talking about rear axles. So the limited slip is kinda new for me.

Thanks all for the information!
 

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achieftain said:
*The new movie CARS - THE Hudson Hornet, winner of back to back to back stock car championships in the '50s (based on the real life adventures of former 'shine runners - would I make this up?), teaches the rookie Lightning McQueen how to "turn left to go right", and as he drifts through the infield in complete control after being shunted off the track. And of course he goes on to- just go see it and enjoy it on about 10 different levels.
Not to be a stickler... but it was 'turn right to go left.'

Sorry, it's pretty much my favorite movie now. :)
 

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dori-san said:
Not to be a stickler... but it was 'turn right to go left.'
You're right! I didn't even notice that, and I've even driven and crewed for mini stockers!
 

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AztekzRpurty said:
Anybody see the drifters grating cheese wheels on "Master of Champions" thursday?

I wish I hadn't. Worst show in the history of ever.

Yeah, I saw it...........I agree , what a lousy show! On a side note........I thought the girl did a way "better job" IMO .....seemed she had more control over what she was doing!
 

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Correct me if Im worng, But didn't the people who put together our Austin run say that they give classes on drifting?? It's definately something I would love to learn to do........... Safely
 
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