Pontiac Solstice Forum banner

1 - 10 of 10 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
936 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Hi to all. I am new here and would like to say that I can't wait until the Solstice hits the market. I have had it as my wall paper on the computer for some time and I am saving those GM card dollars to buy a Solstice. I don't want to be negative but do you really think you will actually buy one for $20,000? The price is one of the things that attracted me to this car as something I could own. I do own a small collection of Pontiacs and have been a loyal Pontiac fan for many years. Having said that my big fear is that dealer greed will ruin the dreams of many. Every time something nice comes to market the dealers try to hold the buyer up for far more than the car is worth( stickers for). Is there any reason to think this car will be any diffrent? I am old enough to not need anything bad enough to allow myself to be taken by someone's greed that I will walk away if this happens. I will also be quite angry at Pontiac if they allow this to happen after telling us for so long that we can get one for $20,000. Anyway I don't know if the subject has came up and was just wondering what others think.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
7,210 Posts
Welcome.

Yup...it's come up and yes we expect it unfortunately. History has shown that the first couple of months there will be dealers pulling this kind of stuff (especially the early ones that are on a lot). It happens with all hot new cars in the first couple of months then dealers have 5 of them sitting on the lot 6 months later after they've pissed off all the customers.

We have a dealer in TX on our site who has guaranteed to sell to members for sticker (GTOJ is his name I think).

I'm going to try to deal with local dealers in my area. I'll most likely be ordering up front but even there they can mess with you when the car comes in. If it gets bad I'll wait a few months but will be pretty mad.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,206 Posts
I actually got a chance to talk to someone from another marketing division (Chevy), but the same rules seem to apply to all the GM domestic divisions except Saturn, which seems to have more franchise control over their dealers (don't ask me how, just accept this - I have no idea how this works).

Apparently, they (GM, the corp) has very little control over what the dealerships actually charge for a car. Pontiac, Cad, Chevy... of all of them, none have the legal (contractual) authority to go to their dealers and dictate policy not agreed-to by the franchise contract.

Something about the formation of Saturn and their franschise contracts (I'm paraphrasing here, or interpreting, or something) permits more control over their dealers than the other brands (like they can dictate no-haggle pricing, or "no combination dealerships", and even some appearance and service items of the dealership and service arms itself).

Chevy, and presumably Pontiac, cannot go to their dealers and say "you will NOT charge above MSRP for these models...". They can suggest it, but the only threat that matters is the ability to revoke franchises, which, as long as the dealership hasn't breached their end of franchise liscense, rarely ever happens. Legally, it can't be revoked for new, made-up policy that was not part of the original contract.

It was a very interesting conversation. Also begs the question: how will Saturn handle the selling of their roadster (remember: all saturns are no-haggle pricing), vs. Pontiac selling their roadster?

All though we'd all love to have MSRP it probably won't happen. We'll just have to grin and bear it, sweet talk our local dealers, or GTOJ will get a BUNCH of orders.

TAFN
 

·
Mod Emeritus
Joined
·
7,468 Posts
Welcome to the forum!

I would expect there to be dealers who go over MSRP initially, but that won't last. As long as you are patient and can wait a few months, you should be able to pick one up at sticker or less. Its really hard to say how long demand will remain high. The 2 seat roadster market is not very large right now in this price range, so the proposed Solstrice production numbers should be able to stay ahead of demand in the long run. How long it will take for the "gotta have it" people to run in and buy their car is anybody's guess. It may also depend on whether GM leaks out word of when we might see a supercharged version of the car, as many people may hold off buying the initial car in anticipation of a faster version.

As for that $20K price, I would expect GM to offer a version under that price since they have been preaching it since day one and not offering it below that price would be an embarrassment at this point.

BTW, what other Pontiacs do you own/have you owned?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,844 Posts
A year ago March, I went into a Mini dealer in LA, fully intent on buying a car that day. I had read the basic Cooper was under $20,000 and the S was around $25,000. By the time they tacked on the "required options" and the $5,000 BWC (Because We Can) surcharge, they were asking $26,000 and $32,000 before tax and registration! That's a more than 20% dealer mark up! I left in my rental moblie loving the car but hating the dealer! I guess that's why I see so few Mini's on the road.

There have been a few articles on this forum about similar problems with the GTO and GM's attempts to control dealers. I predict a $2,000 to $3,000 mark up at the local dealers for at least the first six months. If your anywhere near Dallas, contact GTOJ. I plan on putting my name on his list when the available colors are announced.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
533 Posts
DreamerDave said:
A year ago March, I went into a Mini dealer in LA, fully intent on buying a car that day. I had read the basic Cooper was under $20,000 and the S was around $25,000. By the time they tacked on the "required options" and the $5,000 BWC (Because We Can) surcharge, they were asking $26,000 and $32,000 before tax and registration! That's a more than 20% dealer mark up! I left in my rental moblie loving the car but hating the dealer! I guess that's why I see so few Mini's on the road.

There have been a few articles on this forum about similar problems with the GTO and GM's attempts to control dealers. I predict a $2,000 to $3,000 mark up at the local dealers for at least the first six months. If your anywhere near Dallas, contact GTOJ. I plan on putting my name on his list when the available colors are announced.
When the 350Z was introduced, a lot of pre-order customers were locking the car in at MSRP (I was one of them). The best deals seemed to be only $100-$200 under MSRP (at Car Max dealers that sold new Nissans). Some dealers were adding $5K-$10K for available cars that weren't pre-ordered. Towards the end of the first model year however, discounts of more than $1500 could be found (MSRP for the Z ranged from about $27K-$37K depending on model and options). Not sure whether Solstice pricing will follow the same mark-up/mark-down pattern, but just passing this on as another data point.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
936 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
Fformula88 said:
BTW, what other Pontiacs do you own/have you owned?
I have a 71 Lemans Sport cnovertable with factory 400, 4spd, 3:55 posi rear, A 77 Can Am, A 86 Grand Prix I bought new with V-8 4BBl and many other options which I have managed to keep as new for future collectiable. I sold my 68 Firebird about 6 months ago. I have owned several 79Trans Am's,and other Grand Prixs. I currently have a 97 Bonneville and put each of my children in a Pontiac. My one departure from Pontiac is a 77 Malibu Classic with the swivle bucket interior that I intend to make a nice street machine out of.

My intentions for a Solstice is just a real nice looking fair weather every day driving car. It has to look good and handle well and be fun to drive, as well as a quality car. I think the car will meet all that just as it is. Not since the 79 Trans Am have I been so excited about a new car and I love the fact that it is a Pontiac.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
7,210 Posts
tcl said:
When the 350Z was introduced, a lot of pre-order customers were locking the car in at MSRP (I was one of them). The best deals seemed to be only $100-$200 under MSRP (at Car Max dealers that sold new Nissans). Some dealers were adding $5K-$10K for available cars that weren't pre-ordered. Towards the end of the first model year however, discounts of more than $1500 could be found (MSRP for the Z ranged from about $27K-$37K depending on model and options). Not sure whether Solstice pricing will follow the same mark-up/mark-down pattern, but just passing this on as another data point.
Hey TCL, when you locked in MSRP on your pre-order, did you have the dealer specify MSRP in the contract? I've even heard dealers can mess with you there too if they really want to be nasty. Someone said they only way it's an official contact is if your sales contract has a VIN. I'm hoping a pre-order will get MSRP on Solstice too.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
533 Posts
mceb said:
Hey TCL, when you locked in MSRP on your pre-order, did you have the dealer specify MSRP in the contract? I've even heard dealers can mess with you there too if they really want to be nasty. Someone said they only way it's an official contact is if your sales contract has a VIN. I'm hoping a pre-order will get MSRP on Solstice too.
I don't know how official my initial order was, but it was signed by the sales manager. What I did to minimize the chance of getting marked up was to research dealers that had good sales reputations here: http://www.checkbook.org/
I was lucky since my area was one of those that was covered by this rating service.

I put down a small deposit before the MSRP was even announced and once they were taking official pre-orders, there was a more formal sales contract (and a larger deposit requirement). The first less formal order just said "MSRP". The official pre-order which was written much later had the actual price instead of the word "MSRP". Nissan went out of their way to prevent price gouging on pre-orders for this car but some dealers did it anyway.

My bottom line recommendation is to try to find a dealer you can trust. I think this will give you the best chance of not being taken.

PS: the official manufacturer pre-order program started about 8 months before the first delivery for this vehicle
 

·
Mod Emeritus
Joined
·
7,468 Posts
ateam_77 said:
I have a 71 Lemans Sport cnovertable with factory 400, 4spd, 3:55 posi rear, A 77 Can Am, A 86 Grand Prix I bought new with V-8 4BBl and many other options which I have managed to keep as new for future collectiable. I sold my 68 Firebird about 6 months ago. I have owned several 79Trans Am's,and other Grand Prixs. I currently have a 97 Bonneville and put each of my children in a Pontiac. My one departure from Pontiac is a 77 Malibu Classic with the swivle bucket interior that I intend to make a nice street machine out of.

My intentions for a Solstice is just a real nice looking fair weather every day driving car. It has to look good and handle well and be fun to drive, as well as a quality car. I think the car will meet all that just as it is. Not since the 79 Trans Am have I been so excited about a new car and I love the fact that it is a Pontiac.
That sounds like a really nice fleet of vehicles you have and or have had! My 88 Fiero is the only Pontiac I have personally owned. HoI was hooked by the 79 Trans Am. My uncle has owned one since new, and I have always thought it was an awesome car growing up! I always intended to get a Trans Am, but my father later bought an 87 Fiero, and I decided I liked that too. Seven years ago I finally found my Fiero, and here I am today. I am excited about the Solstice and cannot wait!

About the GTO: Dealers were charging over MSRP, but I cannot imagine many are left doing that now. They are not selling nearly as well as anticipated. The Pontiac dealer around the corner from me has 4 on his lot now, and you can chose any one of them for $1500 off MSRP! If they cannot move them now, how will they move them in 2 years as people wait for the redesign!
 
1 - 10 of 10 Posts
Top