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Are the reported number of Sol's sold realistic, or exaggerated

  • I believe these sales figures have to be exaggerated.

    Votes: 13 23.2%
  • I think these are realistic figures.

    Votes: 43 76.8%

  • Total voters
    56
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Wow, I keep reading reviews, and it seems every review is reporting a higher number of Sols which have already been ordered. I have now seen numbers floating around between 8,000 and 15,000 Sols which already have been claimed! :eek:

Call me skeptical, but I am starting to wonder how accurate some of these numbers are. It seems a lot of dealers still have some allocation left in their first 4 month allocation. Others are sold out, but since they are not ALL sold out of their first 4 month, I wonder how we are getting figures that are getting close to the full first year production run.

Do you think these numbers are being exaggerated to create extra hype and buzz, and to get people out to their dealers to get an order in "before it is too late?" Or do you think they are realistic?
 

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I think they're realistic...the dealer in VA that I got mine through....said they had over 30 orders. They had a lot of potential buyers that when they came in and saw my car on display...ponied up deposits. Although I have an EOP...I'll probably put a deposit down for a 2007 GXP after the SEMA show.
 

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Yeah impression I have from reading articles is they have sold more Solstice this year (2005) then they can realisticly produce. Wonder what it will be like when more hit the road? Could turn into one of the more popular autos ever produced by GM.
 

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I think it's probably close to accurate. Hey, my original dealer already had over 40 deposit orders by April 25th!! I can only IMAGINE what they have by now! So I could see that some dealers have allocation left while others are far beyond that.
 

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The numbers DO seem to add up....

Even at my dealership, on that fateful Friday 2005-04-15, they had 8 other people show up and try to order a Solstice. The list has only grown since then, even with some folks dropping out.

In calling back many of the dealerships in early June, I found that their waiting lists were about 10-15 deep--well beyond their first 4 month allocations. Most of the dealers had enough people already on the waiting lists to cover all of their first 4 month allocation plus (if the allocations remained the same), their second allocation, and into the first few of their 3rd allocation. An example was one dealership in Pasadena who had a first 4 month allocation of 7, with about 20 people on a waiting list.

The point of all of this is that with about 2800 dealerships, and more than 70% (a conservative guess based on the difficulty folks have finding 1st 4 month allocations) of them waiting listed through almost the end of their 2nd allocation by June (conservatively figure about 12 per dealership), these figures seem about right:
2800 * 70% * 12 = 23,520

15,000 / 2800 = 5.3 average orders per dealer​
So, the 15,000 number seems quite reasonable.

Now, for more evidence, at the dealership where I placed my order, they didn't even enter more than about 4 of the orders (they only entered 2 that day) into the VOM system, despite having 9 people there. From some of the other posts, this behavior from the dealers is typical: they seem reluctant to create VOM orders if they don't have the cars to sell.

Thus, when GM reports the number of orders, they do so by looking in the VOM system, and if there is lag in when the order is requested by the customer and when it's entered into the VOM system, then these numbers make even more sense.

In June, GM had somewhere North of 8500 "orders", so it makes sense that now that some are shipping, dealers are becoming less reluctant to enter orders into the VOM system. Result, the numbers continue to climb.

For the future, I expect the 2006 model year to sell out before the end of the year, but certainly before the end of Q1 2006. I say this, because the numbers are staggering, and few Solstices have "hit the streets"--once these things are seen on the road, the foot traffic into the dealerships will start to trend upward, an the remaining units will be ordered by folks who haven't yet noticed the car.

In my own experience, there was only one person at work who knew about the existence of the Solstice, and most of them were car people. The marketing to date has been very successful, and the market will only improve when Solstice sightings become more common.

So, yes, I believe in the veracity of the sales numbers--the Solstice is a hit.
 

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Well....where do I start??

Yeah...these numbers sound pretty good, and being a Sols fan, I like it, however the realistic side of me tells me different, specially from all the calls I've gotten lately from GA and AL dealerships about having 1K and first allocation cars available if I want to jump in....so it looks to me that the numbers could have been orders, however I'm not sure how many of them will actually become a sold order once the cars arrive or as time goes by....I would say where talking about a 66% of accuracy on those numbers, so if 9000 is the number expect 6000 to be an actual sold order, if it's 15K expect 10K...
 

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Crimson Avenger said:
Even at my dealership, on that fateful Friday 2005-04-15, they had 8 other people show up and try to order a Solstice. The list has only grown since then, even with some folks dropping out.

In calling back many of the dealerships in early June, I found that their waiting lists were about 10-15 deep--well beyond their first 4 month allocations. Most of the dealers had enough people already on the waiting lists to cover all of their first 4 month allocation plus (if the allocations remained the same), their second allocation, and into the first few of their 3rd allocation. An example was one dealership in Pasadena who had a first 4 month allocation of 7, with about 20 people on a waiting list.

The point of all of this is that with about 2800 dealerships, and more than 70% (a conservative guess based on the difficulty folks have finding 1st 4 month allocations) of them waiting listed through almost the end of their 2nd allocation by June (conservatively figure about 12 per dealership), these figures seem about right:
2800 * 70% * 12 = 23,520

15,000 / 2800 = 5.3 average orders per dealer​
So, the 15,000 number seems quite reasonable.

Now, for more evidence, at the dealership where I placed my order, they didn't even enter more than about 4 of the orders (they only entered 2 that day) into the VOM system, despite having 9 people there. From some of the other posts, this behavior from the dealers is typical: they seem reluctant to create VOM orders if they don't have the cars to sell.

Thus, when GM reports the number of orders, they do so by looking in the VOM system, and if there is lag in when the order is requested by the customer and when it's entered into the VOM system, then these numbers make even more sense.

In June, GM had somewhere North of 8500 "orders", so it makes sense that now that some are shipping, dealers are becoming less reluctant to enter orders into the VOM system. Result, the numbers continue to climb.

For the future, I expect the 2006 model year to sell out before the end of the year, but certainly before the end of Q1 2006. I say this, because the numbers are staggering, and few Solstices have "hit the streets"--once these things are seen on the road, the foot traffic into the dealerships will start to trend upward, an the remaining units will be ordered by folks who haven't yet noticed the car.

In my own experience, there was only one person at work who knew about the existence of the Solstice, and most of them were car people. The marketing to date has been very successful, and the market will only improve when Solstice sightings become more common.

So, yes, I believe in the veracity of the sales numbers--the Solstice is a hit.
I had somewhat the opposite situation. I know of several dealers taking orders and entering them into the system even though they have little hope of ever receiving that many cars. One local dealer has over 30 cars entered into the system with a first allocation of 4.
 

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The Tempest GTO was also a big hit, and proved the critics wrong...

otalldon said:
Yeah impression I have from reading articles is they have sold more Solstice this year (2005) then they can realisticly produce. Wonder what it will be like when more hit the road? Could turn into one of the more popular autos ever produced by GM.
Yes, as I posted in this thread, a hit can be really big: link to: Solstice Production Levels: Let's hope history rhymes!
Crimson Avenger said:
"History doesn't repeat itself, but it rhymes." is a quote most often attributed to Mark Twain. In our case, I hope that production numbers for this new little Pontiac take a similar path to what happened just over 40 years ago....

Back then, there was a fellow at GM, John DeLorean, who took a Pontiac Tempest (a small midsized car) put a 389 V8 with a Carter AFB 4 BBL carb, dual exhaust, and a Hurst shifter in it as a test car which he drove and let others drive. It was introduced as a $325 GTO option for the Tempest/LeMans in 1964.
From PONTIAC GTO - A History of The Original Muscle Car:
"Initial sales projections called for only 5,000 units; however, the GTO was an immense hit with the public. The 1964 model run produced a total of 32,450 units."
The following years saw even greater sales. In 1965, they sold 75,352 units [gmfleet.com]. For 1966, the sales were even stronger:
From PONTIAC GTO - A History of The Original Muscle Car:
"Several strong competitors had joined the GTO by 1966, but that didn't stop GTO sales from reaching nearly 100,000. The final tally was an astonishing 96,946 units - pretty impressive for a car that insiders doubted would sell 5,000 two years earlier."
So, GM has responded to market demand in the past, and as others on this forum have said, the Kappa, with its use of high initial investment hydroforming for frame and body components, offers substantial per unit cost savings which become even more attractive at increased production volumes.

Will history rhyme with the Pontiac Solstice... some 40 years later? I've got my fingers crossed.

Pontiac seems to have gotten off on the right foot:
  1. The marketing campaign that they have will certainly help them gauge customer interest levels, and gain solid sales leads.
  2. The first-come-first-served Early Order Program for the 1st 1000 is encouraging because of its egalitarian approach.
  3. The magic of the '64 GTO was that it was reasonably priced: the Solstice is likewise reasonably priced.
  4. The '64 GTO was born from the enthusiasts and later models could be ordered with racing oriented options: GM has indicated they will provide some factory performance upgrade parts for the Solstice (Might they become factory installed options on future model year vehicles? Time will tell.).
Lets hope GM lets Pontiac chart this new course.
It's quite clear that the Kappa platform cannot reach the incredible volumes that the Tempest GTO acheived, but it seems completely plausable that a break through product like the Solstice could sell out early...

Also, don't forget, that the population of the United States has increased by a substantial percentage since 1964 (191,889,000 in 1964 increasing to 288,600,000 in 2002--a 50% increase) [source: US Census Beaureu Mini Historical Statistics web page No. HS-1. Population:1900to2002—Con. in PDF format].
 

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Fformula88 said:
Do you think these numbers are being exaggerated to create extra hype and buzz, and to get people out to their dealers to get an order in "before it is too late?" Or do you think they are realistic?
I don't think they're exaggerated, and that concerns me as to whether or not a lot of us will get this car, at least thsi MY. For me it becomes a problem after May of next year because I have to have another car by then. If it is an exaggeration, it could backfire because a lot of people could just decide to give up.
 

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I agree with CA. I actually asked a similar question in a thread some time ago( http://www.solsticeforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4134) I was curious about the order numbers GM was coming up with too - except my assumption was that they were too low. As was stated above, many dealers were not entering deposited orders into the VOMs system. Therefore, the numbers that GM was reporting MUST have been too low. So maybe we're finally approaching the ACTUAL number of orders.

YIKES!!! :willy:
 

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I think it's accurate....or pretty close. 34 sold by Dave Smith Motors here in piddlin' North Idaho. I think we've got an instant automotive legend on our hands, folks!
 
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