[ChopTop]

Been reading these articles w/interest due to it possibly leading to not only allowing the public to buy Tesla cars directly from the manufacture but the possibility of buying any car directly from manufacture to public in the future. Regardless, will take years and more than likely end up being decided by SCOTUS.

Tesla gains legal ground in New York dealer fight

New York state legislature fails to address anti-Tesla EV bill

Lawsuits filed against Tesla stores in NY, MA

NY dealers try to make it illegal to register a Tesla EV

Elon Musk explains why Tesla has its own stores, defends service program

 

[LatinVenom]

I hope this comes to be in our modern times.
We buy directly from the internet bypassing local companies.
I know cars need service but when it comes to electric ones there are a lot of less components to fail.
Must people hate the Dealer experience. I wish the dealer would be part of the manufacturer as a service and drop off point and not as a seller.

 

[ChopTop]

Biggest question is would be if manufacturers even want to be involved with direct sales/service since the automotive industry is moving toward being project managers in order to also avoid being held directly responsible for; wages, health benefits, pensions, etc. By sub-contracting services out it become harder for a union to form.

 

[Freaky Tiki]

I'm definitely not going to feel comfortable taking my Tesla (I wish) to my local Buick-GMC-Tesla dealer for servicing.. :willy:

 

[cdflint]

Is it the dealer or the manufacturers behind this? Both. Manufacturers have always hated competition, especially if Tesla could be a better product with a better sales model. They prefer to compete on who is already there and not allow another car maker a chance to cut into their profit. If its a success for Tesla then the big companies may say "why aren't we doing that" and cut out dealers? So Dealer owners would then not want this as they would be cut out of their profit or dealerships completely as they would not be able to cut prices as much as direct operation.

Direct operations is not a new model. Apple has their own stores but sells at other dealers but they need to sell to the masses and they all have the same price point. Tesla does not want to do that at this time. Heck its there baby. If they want to sell their own product and then get bigger and other dealers want to agree to sell them , its an option in the future. For now, direct sales. I'd bet that if they grew larger and sold more, they would not want to hassle of selling and let a dealership take the risks but again they are small to car company standards.

Tesla is still selling to a niche market that can afford them. I love the looks and the engineering behind them. Hot looking roadster, good looking electric sedans with energy that could be charged with solar panels at home versus Volt or Prius looking cars (BORING!). Like a lot of people I would love to switch to a Tesla roadster or sedan but the truth is, I cant afford it. Hmm, under 20k or 100K? I'm with under 20K. Please, sell a Tesla around 20K and they would take over but they can't for now and their competition can. If they got bigger and had more stores to sell them, maybe the prices would eventually go down. The technology would improve. If any of the car companies could do a solution to the battery problem, we would then be part of the future of electric cars. (sorry, its a bit sidetracked from the topic)

 

[Shadofax]

Is it the dealer or the manufacturers behind this? Both. Manufacturers have always hated competition, especially if Tesla could be a better product with a better sales model. They prefer to compete on who is already there and not allow another car maker a chance to cut into their profit. If its a success for Tesla then the big companies may say "why aren't we doing that" and cut out dealers? So Dealer owners would then not want this as they would be cut out of their profit or dealerships completely as they would not be able to cut prices as much as direct operation.

Direct operations is not a new model. Apple has their own stores but sells at other dealers but they need to sell to the masses and they all have the same price point. Tesla does not want to do that at this time. Heck its there baby. If they want to sell their own product and then get bigger and other dealers want to agree to sell them , its an option in the future. For now, direct sales. I'd bet that if they grew larger and sold more, they would not want to hassle of selling and let a dealership take the risks but again they are small to car company standards.

Tesla is still selling to a niche market that can afford them. I love the looks and the engineering behind them. Hot looking roadster, good looking electric sedans with energy that could be charged with solar panels at home versus Volt or Prius looking cars (BORING!). Like a lot of people I would love to switch to a Tesla roadster or sedan but the truth is, I cant afford it. Hmm, under 20k or 100K? I'm with under 20K. Please, sell a Tesla around 20K and they would take over but they can't for now and their competition can. If they got bigger and had more stores to sell them, maybe the prices would eventually go down. The technology would improve. If any of the car companies could do a solution to the battery problem, we would then be part of the future of electric cars. (sorry, its a bit sidetracked from the topic)

You guys mainly nailed it with regard to the competition, and certainly states don't want to disrupt lots of dealer jobs by allowing a direct sales model. Still rediculous, but Tesla has something at this point, and I don't think they will be deterred. I'd love to have the model S, love that car, but for the same gripe above, I can't afford it. The other issue with the batteries is that they are 8 year unlimited warranty, however, if you like to keep your car a long time like I do, when it is replacement time in the 9-10 year range, right now that will set you back around $12k. So the whole battery cost has to come down, even though one could argue that basic maintenance annually will be less for sure (but not nearly enough to offset that battery cost). A bit more range extension over the next couple years would be nice, and weight reduction, but basically I taught myself to weld and so have a 14-50 230V plug in the garage all ready to go, which overnight would also fully charge my model S and would be pretty cheap.

Edit: I also just read that the base 60kwh model S seems to be understated on it's 0-60 times, as stated by a track magazine that tested it. This car is more reasonable on cost to purchase, and is said to have a 5.9 time (much slower than the performance version which can do mid 4's), yet multiple tests on a fully charged car had them consistently clocking around 5.1 seconds, big difference.

Does anyone own one? Has anyone driven an electric, I've thought about scheduling a test drive? The instant 100% torque and acceleration......

 

[ChopTop]

I believe most are in a hold pattern when it comes to electric cars, plus is electricity really the answer as long as some electrical plants continue to contaminate the environment by continuing to burn fossil fuel to generate electricity? Hydrogen also seems like technical possibility if the pesky four wheel bomb issue can be worked out.

As I said, I don't see car companies wanting to embrace direct sales if it would require hiring more employees and setting up both a sales system and an after the sales system. Sure that would enable them to have more control but car companies don't want more employees they want less. Another option would be bidding out the services or completely subcontract them out. That way they'd still have more control without being directly responsible for employees, benefits, health care, or the possibility of unionization.

But they are somewhat involved now with the sales and service process because they set the MSRP, along w/dealerships consulting the manufactures repair time frames and parts costs of parts to establish repair estimate, along with establishing the cost of replacement parts, and covering the costs of warranted items. However, dealers don't pay retail for parts and certainly don't pay their mechanics $100 dollar an hour service work.

Regardless, the federal anti trust laws are somewhat outdated in that they were instituted at a time in history when it look or appeared like an American car company could possible turn into a monopoly in the USA.

Give China 10 to 15 years and they could possibly end up doing it.

 

[rob the elder]

I would love to see direct sales of everything. I LOVE the Amazon model and buy from them at every opportunity. When Amazon decides to sell new cars, the walls will come tumbling down. The old way of doing business is going out the window one market niche at a time.

I personally believe that we are rapidly approaching the time when "green" cars will have to compete on a more even basis in the market.

The initiatives to force "green" cars to pay their "fair share" in a market where the collection mechanism does not apply to them (gasoline taxes) was ok when they were a tiny minority of the tax base, but now they are becoming a victim of their own success as tax hungry liberals are in pursuit of their money. New mechanisms for redistribution of wealth are in order!

Another force that is beginning to be felt is with the vast amounts of fossil fuel being found and brought to market internal to the US (Dakota) the price and availablity of gasoline and diesel will allow the price per mile to continue to drop. Perhaps precipitiously when combined with the new CAFE standards driven requirements. This increased efficiency (lower cost of ownership) for gasoline poweredcars will be a further drain on the electric car market.

Finally there is a growing voice in the green wilderness that is starting to gather an audience that says that the "green" cars are actually as harmful or maybe even MORE harmful to the environment over their lifecycle than gasoline powered cars.

We may be approaching a point in time when you have options that include gas, diesel, electric and the best cost / functionality solution for YOUR needs will win your dollars.

But in the near term, a lot of people I consider uninformed or missguided will continue to buy and drive their electric cars while patting themselves on the back for how good they are at being green.:agree:

 

[ChopTop]

BMW web sales plan opposed by German dealers - Autoblog

Tesla isn't the only manufacturer that is facing a backlash over its plans to sell cars directly to customers. BMW is under fire from its German dealerships over its desire to sell its cars via the internet.

BMW has plans to sell the new i3 through the World Wide Web, while a "Mobile Sales Force" will be making house calls. According to Automotive News Europe, Head of German Sales Roland Krueger told German weekly Wirtschaftswoche, "We can imagine that Internet sales could be expanded to all models." This is the particular caveat that has traditional brick-and-mortar dealers so up in arms.

According to the head of BMW's German dealerships Werner Entenmann, "We told BMW in no uncertain terms that we cannot accept direct sales channels." Reuters reports that an anonymous dealer has gone so far as to pledge not to use the sales force in Germany. Krueger, for what it's worth, told Wirtschaftswoche that the "backbone" of BMW sales will still be traditional dealerships.